Topic: Reduce the difficulty of Lightfoot Gold (Read 8878 times)

Omegthemad · « **on:** May 06, 2011, 10:52 »

As it stands, to get the Lightfoot Gold Badge, you need to complete an Angel of Light Travel game on Nightmare!. This seems wrong, as it means there's at least one Platinum badge - UAC Platinum - which is strictly easier to get than at least one Gold badge.

With this in mind, I'd reduce the requirement to completing Angel of Light Travel on Ultra-Violence, and if anyone really cares, add Lightfoot Platinum with the same requirements as the current Lightfoot Gold. (Honestly this is probably going to be more of a discussion point than an added feature which actually affects me, it'll be ages before I feel ready to take on Ultra-Violence in the general case...)

grommile · « **Reply #1 on:** May 06, 2011, 12:46 »

It's been the case for a long time that the badge tiers overlap.

That said, having a Gold badge invoke N! difficulty does seem Just. Plain. Wrong.

BirdoPrey · « **Reply #2 on:** May 06, 2011, 13:57 »

Agreed. Current situation is just silly.

Thomas · « **Reply #3 on:** May 07, 2011, 00:15 »

Considering how easy AoLT is, I'd say the solution isn't just to bump it down to UV and call it a day. Even something like "Beat UV AoLT without master traits" would fit a bit better and introduce a slightly more interesting challenge to the non-diamond badge levels.

MaiZure · « **Reply #4 on:** May 07, 2011, 01:50 »

AoLT victories on either UV or N! have not been posted in the mortems since 0.9.8.10 which would says that it isn't much fun to play. There are a few examples from before that but obviously gameplay has changed quite a bit since then.

As for the Gold difficulty idea, I think its probably fine the way it is. If we say 'No N! Gold Badges' then should we also try to 'fix' the handful of gold badges that have low difficulty requirements? True, it seems logical to want to normalize difficulty and badge levels, I think it leads to a more generic advancement experience.

Side Note: I've never gotten this badge either.

Kornel Kisielewicz · « **Reply #5 on:** May 07, 2011, 02:14 »

Should we remove AoLT altogether?

MaiZure · « **Reply #6 on:** May 07, 2011, 02:25 »

Quote from: Kornel Kisielewicz on May 07, 2011, 02:14

Should we remove AoLT altogether?

I'm in favor of that.
The idea of inventory constraint seems more of a holdover from when the game was much more simple.
Similar to the fate of Angel of Darkness

thelaptop · « **Reply #7 on:** May 07, 2011, 04:06 »

Quote from: Kornel Kisielewicz on May 07, 2011, 02:14

Should we remove AoLT altogether?

Personally, I think I have played at most 2 games of AoLT. Given the current increase in complexity of the game, I suggest that we give more incentive for people to play AoLT as an alternative to complete removal of the mode: give a speed boost to Doomguy so that AoLT plays like 0.9.9.0. Think about it, you are travelling with half your backpack size, surely you should be moving faster?

Thomas · « **Reply #8 on:** May 07, 2011, 05:10 »

I'd be all for removing AoLT if it was replaced with a more interesting challenge. Or, if AoLT's conditions could be changed to make it more interesting within the light travel theme, that would also be good.

Kornel Kisielewicz · « **Reply #9 on:** May 07, 2011, 05:13 »

A speed boost would make the game easier. However, how about a more drastic reduction of inventory size (like 6-7) *and* a visible speed boost?

Or even in a more tactical change -- remove armor penalties from AoLT?

grommile · « **Reply #10 on:** May 07, 2011, 05:25 »

Quote from: MaiZure on May 07, 2011, 01:50

If we say 'No N! Gold Badges' then should we also try to 'fix' the handful of gold badges that have low difficulty requirements?

I specifically think that the "Complete Angel of X" badges should not demand that you play at the difficulty setting of the next tier's UAC Badge. Lightfoot Gold is the only "Complete Angel of X" badge to do so. (Lightfoot Silver demands HMP, but that's OK, because UAC Silver also demands HMP, and UAC Gold demands UV.)

Kornel: I wouldn't say you should remove AoLT, but I wouldn't say you shouldn't, and I wouldn't miss it if you did.

Brewtal Legend · « **Reply #11 on:** May 07, 2011, 12:10 »

Quote

Similar to the fate of Angel of Darkness

I liked this idea. Kinda miss it.

Maybe you could find a way to combine light travel and darkness modes for a more interesting challenge mode?

Omegthemad · « **Reply #12 on:** May 08, 2011, 00:29 »

Subjective overlap between tiers depending on your skill set I have no problem with; it's just there is no possible way in which a challenge mode on N! can be easier than a normal run on N! the way Light Travel currently is.

Or you could just remove/drastically change AoLT, having the current form of the challenge doesn't add much to a normal game.

Deathwind · « **Reply #13 on:** May 08, 2011, 14:27 »

Weapons and armor are heavy, right? So make it that AoLT can only carry your currently equipped armor and weapons. If you pick up a new weapon or armor, it auto-equips, just like the first time you get the chainsaw.

Dorten · « **Reply #14 on:** May 11, 2011, 01:33 »

Quote from: Deathwind on May 08, 2011, 14:27

Weapons and armor are heavy, right? So make it that AoLT can only carry your currently equipped armor and weapons. If you pick up a new weapon or armor, it auto-equips, just like the first time you get the chainsaw.

Me votes for it. I'd also suggest not allowing to carry two non-pistol guns.

thelaptop · « **Reply #15 on:** May 11, 2011, 02:35 »

Ooo... L4D/Halo style!

=D

Deathwind · « **Reply #16 on:** May 11, 2011, 23:48 »

On top of this leave the inventory at 10.

Would you grab a BFG at the cost of your rocket launcher?
Is red armor's 4 defense worth giving up tactical armor?

Ander Hammer · « **Reply #17 on:** May 12, 2011, 15:07 »

Quote from: thelaptop on May 11, 2011, 02:35

Ooo... L4D/Halo style!

=D

Angel of Infection [AoIn]

More people were in that base than you thought, and Hell runneth over with those who were once human, but are now something more...

Very few demons in the game. Instead, there's floods and floods of formers, with the occasional badass demon (Mancubus, Revenant, Arch-Vile) thrown in when the AI director wishes. For extra fun, make it really L4D-style and only allow two weapons. It's not like you'll have ammo problems...

Yes I like L4d a lot

Angles of death · « **Reply #18 on:** May 14, 2011, 00:57 »

Quote from: Brewtal Legend on May 07, 2011, 12:10

I liked this idea. Kinda miss it.

Maybe you could find a way to combine light travel and darkness modes for a more interesting challenge mode?

That would be awesome!

What could it be called, though? Angel of No Light Travel?

Solarn · « **Reply #19 on:** May 14, 2011, 01:17 »

Quote from: Angles of death on May 14, 2011, 00:57

That would be awesome!

What could it be called, though? Angel of No Light Travel?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7yl3UMO-TkE

GrimmC · « **Reply #20 on:** May 16, 2011, 09:39 »

Ugh, no thanks for Halo influence. In Doom you're a running tank, carrying a million guns and 2000 pounds of ammo all at once while moving fast enough to outdistance missiles and fireballs. (I mean, 100 rockets? Seriously?) Even in Lightfoot, that should always be an option...it's sort of what Doom's all about, as I see it. It's just an option that comes at the cost of carrying anything else. Even Doom 3 kept all the guns...

Gargulec · « **Reply #21 on:** May 16, 2011, 10:23 »

Quote from: GrimmC on May 16, 2011, 09:39

Ugh, no thanks for Halo influence. In Doom you're a running tank, carrying a million guns and 2000 pounds of ammo all at once while moving fast enough to outdistance missiles and fireballs. (I mean, 100 rockets? Seriously?) Even in Lightfoot, that should always be an option...it's sort of what Doom's all about, as I see it. It's just an option that comes at the cost of carrying anything else. Even Doom 3 kept all the guns...

But wait, is not lifting the traditions of Doom the entire point of challenge modes?

GrimmC · « **Reply #22 on:** May 16, 2011, 11:22 »

Perhaps...that's not particularly how I see it but I'm just speaking for myself here. Currently the challenges are Compet-N style challenges (Tyson, Pacisfist, Pistol, Speedruns) or alter the DoomRL formula (less inventory, max accuracy, amount of levels, etc.) They're not altering the fundamentals, one of which, to me, is having as many guns as you want.

But that's just my take on it.

Deathwind · « **Reply #23 on:** May 18, 2011, 00:49 »

The entire point of AoLT is to limit what you can carry but just the inventory restriction just doesn't seem to be enough. This challenge needs an update or a removal and I was giving an option for said update. Many of the challenges have received major updates and are better for it, remember how the old weapon challenges locked the gun in you hand.

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Author Topic: Reduce the difficulty of Lightfoot Gold (Read 8878 times)

GrimmC

GrimmC