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[Ander Hammer]

DoomRL is delightful. It's based on a game I love, and so far it's either added better things to the mix or people are at least talking about the not-so-good. It does get a few suggestions to fix what ain't broken, and this might be one of them, but it's only a thought I had.

A core part of both Doom and DoomRL is movement. In Doom... hell, you were moving all the time. I can't be the only one who strafes back and forth while waiting for a long elevator, or jams down the shift key and exaggerates circle-strafes in big fights. And in Doom, while you're moving, you're also almost always shooting.

I didn't really pay much attention before, since they're fundamentally different games and changing things now would mess with the balance, but now it kind of bothers me. In DoomRL, you have to stop to shoot your gun, and looking at it through the Doom lens, it feels a little like it breaks the flow.

How broken would it be if you could set a direction to walk, then automatically step in that direction regardless* of what your next action is, continuing to do so until your next action is a movement or change in direction? Yeah, it would totally change the game and make it a bunch easier, but I'd like to hear other people's take on it.


*except for sticking a chainsaw into something.

[Matt_S]

I've often wondered what it would be like in a roguelike to be able to move and shoot (or just move and anything else at the same time).  The biggest problem with the general concept would probably be an intuitive control system.

Going with your idea of setting a walking direction and then doing your actions, I'd guess it would be pretty game-changing.  Just as an aside, if you're doing actions that take more or less time than your move time, it could be a pain to tell exactly when you're going to move and how much over several actions.  At the very least, this would make Shottyman worthless since you'd already be able to reload while moving (unless a move-shoot combo would reload with Shottyman, which would be pretty broken).  Corner shooting would still be effective but probably to a relatively less degree, as you would now be able to move out of cover, shoot, and move back behind cover while being exposed for about half as long as at present.  It would probably make demons and lost souls easier since you could kill them while maintaining your distance.  And it would also generally make firefights less dangerous since you could dodge while still killing things (Gun Kata also might need some reworking because of this).

Assuming enemies could do the same thing though, it would have some other effects.  Former sergeants would be approaching you while they are shooting so they'd suffer less from damage drop-off (though you could move away from them at the same time), arch-viles would be an even greater pain in the ass (although since you could also move and shoot it might not be too terrible; melee builds beware though), etc.  It probably wouldn't compensate for your advantage since enemies can't dodge your shots.  Though the whole idea of enemies having only a certain chance to fire should probably be reworked if this were the case; right now, that serves at least partially to let them approach you a bit, but if they can do that while still attacking then it just makes them weaker than their numbers suggest they ought to be.

[GrimmC]

Maybe an idea for DoomRL 2?

[Sambojin]

I'm not saying I agree with it, just an idea of how to implement it....

Just put it as another option in the tactics menu. Cautious->Run->Run&Gun. Run and gun could either be a fire-time reducer (with say 1/2 run&gun time compared to normal running), or give free fire actions once per move. Either way, you'd need a big hit on accuracy and have to do something with shotguns.

It would give you a bit of a relief from those times you accidently hit TAB twice when you wanted to run. But it is pretty overpowered, even with a -4 accuracy hit and -2d3 damage on shotguns it might still be too good. It'd have to be tested a heap, since it's a core gameplay mechanic.

Sort of too hard for too little gain really (just get your firetime/movetime as low as you can for a similar effect). Turn based games do have their limits (such as discreet player action turns). DoomRL has the closest thing to circle strafing I've seen in a roguelike as it is.

I wonder if there could be a master(?)-trait that either gives a shottyman like move/reload for all weapons (say half shot multiplier, min 1) for all other weapons? Or a move-when-chain-firing ability (-accuracy but 1 sec move included with chainfiring)? The second would give the right effect, but boy would it be good.

[Ander Hammer]

Maybe an idea for DoomRL 2?

Maybe.

Or a move-when-chain-firing ability (-accuracy but 1 sec move included with chainfiring)?

I am all about this being the Scout rapidfire master instead of silly old Cateye. Or I guess a change to Running Man.

Not to say every marine couldn't be able to do this. Run and gun as a tactic setting sort of sounds like an okay compromise. Balancing shotguns and accuracy is the main problem... I'd say increase drop-off since you're firing from the hip, and/or shorten the cone's range.

Enemies would not be able to run and gun, since the only instance of this happening in Doom that I can recall is when Cacos get blasted while shooting and don't die. Everything else has to stop to fire, however briefly. Doomguy alone is badass enough to combine two simple actions.