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[skarczew]

Also, while it blocks SoB, it does NOT block EE.  EE is a significant damage increase for chainfire weapons - I dare say much more important for enemies on the edge of vision.  There is no reason you have to beeline for your master trait - taking 1 or 2 levels of another helpful trait can really increase your gameplan.  EE also allows you to focus on mods/assemblies that add damage instead of accuracy.  MAc suffers in the damage department unless you get a lucky S mod or laser rifle.  EE builds can go for e.g. burst cannon assembly.

I am not sure that MAc suffers in damage department ... A-modded Plasma Rifle melts enemies pretty well.

Msv - briefly, it does not block SoG and EE.  5 levels of SoG turns any character with a decent pistol into a juggernaut of destruction.  The only limit is reload time, and 10mm chains can help.  You can go for this trait and put everything else into SoG.

5 levels of SoG surely would change you into a nice Sniper, but you need to get several levels to finish such build.

And I agree with Large Medpacks giving 150% health. While talking about it, what about making it possible to take the trait for the second time? Coudl give 200/250% and increased chance to avoid 2 damage, for example.

Also, the trait does NOT block eagle eye.  You can get a lot more efficiency out of your chain fire weapons with a point here.  With regard to skarczew's comment - a MEn character with a point or two in eagle eye is going to do more damage than an ammochain character. 

And the same as MAc char with A-modded weapon ;) .

One note: I am not MAc fanatic, but I see its pros and cons ...and I did once some really nice runs with it =) .

Second note: I am not sure how old are those Master traits, but maybe some time should be given to them, so the players actually learn how to use them (if there is some potential in them).

[Ander Hammer]

Random post in defense of mEn:

Take WK. Build specialized armors. Listen to monsters (or get shot) and swap armors when needed.

Congratulations, you are now a berserk gunner.

I do like the idea of the bonuses scaling a little, going up during warming and full.

Also +1 to generalizing general master traits.

[zenfur]

I find survivalist very nice and use it quite.

About unused traits, I've never used Fireangel, how about you?

[spacedust]

That's an interesting point about Fireangel. I haven't really used it much ever since the change to the class based system, and especially now that FA is bugged and doesn't work as it should. Maybe Fireangel can be made more patently offensive by boosting RL usage? The Rocket Launcher thread is here - (http://forum.chaosforge.org/index.php/topic,5441.0.html)

[Sambojin]

Just as a thought, perhaps MSv and MRM could be tacked onto their current advanced traits in some form? Maybe as a second level of one and an entirely new advanced trait for another? Int(2) is huge, TH(2) is huge as well. Why not lots of hugeness?

Could MSv be made into an advanced trait that comes off Ironman (say Survivalist?) with the first level letting you heal up to 150% and second level to 200% by using medipacks? You'd still need BA to keep your life up there, but it allows many builds to have a go at survivalist, even across all classes. Would that be considered overpowered? Especially considering the current master-trait is considered underpowered?

MRM could simply be looked at as DM(2).  More running time, but maybe cut the "no-loss-of-accuracy" bit. When running, HR(2) gives about a 50% dodge chance along with a free dodge from DM. But DM has always felt like the weak bit of that equation. Would DM(2) giving more running time bring it up to par with other advanced traits?

Whilst on this thought, perhaps shottyman could be made into a two parter as well? First level gives you 1-second-step-reloads, the second level gives you (movement speed)-step-reloads. Just as an option for those really quickly moving builds.

Berserker as a two parter? More chance of berserk from damage perhaps? Or increased attack speed? Perhaps just an extra 5 turns of berserking, both from the trait and from berserk packs? You could do a bit with this one.

Who knows. All these ideas sound a bit too good to me, as well as potentially abusable with class combo's and build ideas. It adds the option to add these "second level" advanced traits into the blocking lists if desired though. It also frees up a couple of master traits so they could be redesigned with extra cool-factor added in. But so very abuseable. It's an idea though......

A techhy with Survivalist might be a TINY bit too good. :)

[raekuul]

Well, since Survivalist is a Marine-exclusive Master Trait, I don't think OP Technician Survivalist will be that much of an issue...

[Sambojin]

It would be if Survivalist was an advanced trait coming off Ironman though (which was sort of the point of the post). "Master"-Survivalist could be something else entirely..........