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Author Topic: In need of some advice!  (Read 3939 times)

AJBuwalda

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In need of some advice!
« on: March 17, 2012, 02:43 »

I'm new to this game and really enjoy it. Up 'till now I have played mostly Chainfiring-builds and really enjoy them. Problem is that I keep dying... alot! I know this is kind of thing with roguelike, but I'd really like some input from you guys about what would help further my games or what for example really helped you break through. Thanks in advance.

AJ
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AJBuwalda

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #1 on: March 17, 2012, 02:48 »

Just some motivation:

Yeah I'm that crappy ;-)
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skarczew

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #2 on: March 17, 2012, 03:30 »

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AJBuwalda

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #3 on: March 17, 2012, 04:13 »

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ZicherCZ

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #4 on: March 17, 2012, 05:15 »

I'm new to this game and really enjoy it. Up 'till now I have played mostly Chainfiring-builds and really enjoy them. Problem is that I keep dying... alot! I know this is kind of thing with roguelike, but I'd really like some input from you guys about what would help further my games or what for example really helped you break through. Thanks in advance.

AJ
Don't worry, AJ. Everyone was a newbie once.
- Watch the tutorials mentioned before. Really, even very advanced players can learn something new from GameHunter.
- Try other builds. Perhaps try shotguns with a rocket launcher as backup? Marine Army of the Dead. Want to see them before they see you? Scout Cateye (this also benefits from you being used to rapid-fire weapons, as you seem to be). Want to try pistols? Technician Sharpshooter (with a lucky tech mod) can fire almost _two_ times as fast as formers right off the bat.
- Know when and where to run. That's true in any roguelike. And in DoomRL, you don't need to fully clear the levels to win.
- Die and learn. Easy as that.

Best of luck to you!
- Use mods and assemblies when available. Whizkid helps a lot.
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Motorheadbanger

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #5 on: March 17, 2012, 07:15 »

One from me — don't forget that this is a turn-based game. You have all the time in the world to think about your next move.
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Alpro

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #6 on: March 18, 2012, 04:56 »

I'm still new too. In my last playthrough, i picked a Scout on HMP difficulty, two levels of Eagle Eye, two of Intuition and Cateye, which allowed me to safely kill enemies from a great distance.I grew in power very slowly, but the 2nd half of the game was a breeze. I won with 100% kills on all levels (only skipped the Unholy Cathedral). I used the following build, maybe it can inspire you:

Int -> Int -> SoB -> SoB -> TH -> MCe -> EE -> Fin -> Jug -> EE -> TH -> SoB -> SoB -> SoB
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spacedust

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #7 on: March 18, 2012, 06:53 »

Cornershooting! Cornershooting basically turns you into an invincible guy in the shadows when you've got a nice spot behind a doorway or pillar to hide behind. See Game Hunter's videos for more elaboration on this. This is the single greatest concept in Doom RL that I haven't found in any other roguelike.
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ZicherCZ

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #8 on: March 18, 2012, 08:27 »

Cornershooting! Cornershooting basically turns you into an invincible guy in the shadows when you've got a nice spot behind a doorway or pillar to hide behind. See Game Hunter's videos for more elaboration on this. This is the single greatest concept in Doom RL that I haven't found in any other roguelike.
This so much.
For a simple model, get something into a position like this:
Code: [Select]
.....
.###.
.# #.
.###@
.B...
The "@" is you, the "B" is a hell baron (works on others as well, though :) ). In this position, you can shoot the baron while he can't fire at you. Have a shotgun to knock it back on your fire, and you can kill the bugger with perfect safety.
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Matt_S

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #9 on: March 18, 2012, 10:50 »

You should also try gift-dropping.  All types of formers plus hell knights and barons love picking up armor, medpacks, and phase devices.  So if you think there's some formers behind a door, you can set a medpack or other gift in front of the door, get diagonal to the door, and open it.  Any formers will come running for the gift, and you can give them some shotgun to the face when they get in the doorway.  You probably shouldn't do quite the same thing against hell knights or barons, because you can't just shotgun them in the face for a one-shot kill.  A melee build with a chainsaw and the Berserker trait can handle them, though.  You can still use gift-dropping to lure them close to you though.

If you want to corner shoot with a non-shotgun weapon, there's a similar setup:
Code: [Select]
........
...###..
...# #..
...###.@
B.......
Basically, by taking a step back you can see where you're going to be shooting, so this is great for chainguns.  If you chainfire against something even as strong as a hell knight or cacodemon at the end of your vision range, you'll probably kill them before they get close enough to shoot you, especially if you have some levels in eagle eye and son of a bitch or trigger happy.  You could also place a gift right around the corner there to lure hell knights in.  One thing to be very careful about, though, in any corner shooting or gift dropping situation, is making sure enemies aren't going to come from a different angle.  For example:
Code: [Select]
........
...###..
...# #..
...###.@
.....+..
........
........
........
........
.....B..
You won't have any cover against the enemy coming at you, so you'll probably have to retreat around the pillar and maybe even abandon your gift. (I didn't actually count the squares so this probably doesn't reflect your actual vision range)

And on that note, it's important to know what areas are safe to retreat into.  One common trick is to close doors after passing through them, since you can tell by looking at the map whether any enemies have since opened them.  You don't have this luxury in maze levels; I recently lost a character on Ultra-Violence when (despite having a tracking computer >_>) either a baron or hell knight came around behind me as I was fighting some imps near the edge of the map.  I didn't have any place to retreat to except forward into the imps (and some barrels!).  It's not so important on lower difficulties, but phase devices are good for escaping these kinds of situations.  Yeah, sometimes they'll put you in worse situations, but if you know you're screwed it can at least give you a chance to survive.

You may think killing 100% of the enemies and clearing all special levels makes you awesome, and it does =), but when you're still learning the ropes, skipping special levels and leaving levels early can be important.  Once you find the stairs down, you should try to explore the level and find any supplies and kill some enemies, but be prepared to escape; you should probably clear out the area around the stairs first so that it's safe to retreat.  As for special levels, Hell's Arena is a good place to practice corner shooting, so I would say keep doing that level.  And if you do clear Hell's Arena I'd avoid the Chained Court because of the Arena Master.  The Halls of Carnage is probably the only other special level I'd recommend (in fact, you should do it no matter what).
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Klear

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #10 on: March 18, 2012, 11:09 »

The Halls of Carnage is probably the only other special level I'd recommend (in fact, you should do it no matter what).

Well, except on a pacifist run, unless you have a homing phase or boots that make you immune to lava.
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Deathwind

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #11 on: March 18, 2012, 11:22 »

Well, except on a pacifist run, unless you have a homing phase or boots that make you immune to lava.

I've done it without only ONCE and it was hell, you need to get the sargents to blast open the doors for you and then run through the narrow halls at the end hoping to get lucky. Do not try this.
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Klear

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #12 on: March 18, 2012, 12:04 »

Yeah.. I managed to get to the final maze in AoPC once, but the demons ripped me apart (I think). Definitely not worth the supercharges =)
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ZZ

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #13 on: March 18, 2012, 12:34 »

However, if you manage somehow get the enviroboots or something else 100% lavaproof, it's a good place to visit
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Creaphis

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #14 on: March 18, 2012, 13:47 »

On the subject of cornershooting, sometimes I find that monsters are able to attack me from squares that I can't see, so they're effectively cornershooting me. Was DoomRL intentionally programmed so that vision would be asymmetric (as in, A can see B but B can't see A) to make cornershooting possible, or is it just a happy accident?
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shark20061

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #15 on: March 18, 2012, 14:32 »

It turns out that in some of those cases, they actually CAN'T see you (Armory is a good example of this phenomenon), but they have a direct line of fire to you and you're in range, and that's apparently all the AI cares about.
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Ashannar

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Re: In need of some advice!
« Reply #16 on: March 18, 2012, 14:47 »

On the subject of cornershooting, sometimes I find that monsters are able to attack me from squares that I can't see, so they're effectively cornershooting me.

Yeah, but it only happens from one or two specific angles. They can't corner shoot you nearly as effectively as you can corner shoot them. It would seem to me that monsters being able to do it is unintentional, considering how rarely they can do it. But I could be wrong.

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