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Author Topic: The Inferno Module  (Read 88388 times)

tehtmi

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Re: The Inferno Module
« Reply #135 on: May 05, 2022, 23:26 »

Impressive! Always enjoy seeing new mortems here. I was working on this some more last year (although I don't think I uploaded any changes), so I probably still will get around to a new version. I was also trying to practice on UV, but it's hard for me. I don't think I've gotten past Acheron. (I can only blame rust so much.)

I got overwhelmed at Acheron.  I haven't quite gotten a handle on how to take care of the Arch-Viles quickly enough before they ressurrect everything;  I'll have to reconsider my approach next time.  In any case, I burned through all my med packs on that level and I was forced to homing phase out.  I left 46 enemies behind on that level;  up 'til that point, I had a perfect 100% kill ratio.  Oh well...

I think I've known forever that Acheron tends to be a difficulty spike. I may want to adjust it, but I haven't had any ideas that have really struck me. (It's already been revamped once...)

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In the end, I was done in by a pair of Nightmare Spectres that I didn't even see coming.  Somehow, both of them went from being invisible to biting me in the space of the one second I spent reloading my tactical shotgun.  How the heck fast are those guys?!?  I know their whole deal is that you can't see them until they're close, but I really was totally unaware they were there until I was dead.  They must've gotten a triple move on me, and/or they have some kind of variability in how far away they can be seen from or something.  I could have saved my life with my last large med pack, but I really didn't think I was in imminent danger of dying.

Yes, nightmare spectres are fast, but not that fast. There is something else they do. I believe the game tries to hint at it, but it's probably easy to miss. (Assuming things are working properly.)

Hint:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Explanation:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
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Tormuse

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Re: The Inferno Module
« Reply #136 on: May 06, 2022, 08:24 »

Without looking at your two spoiler comments, I did notice that my vision radius was decreasing and increasing periodically on that level, so I assume that has something to do with their presence.  I honestly can't remember whether my vision was in a reduced state at the time I got munched, so I probably should have paid closer attention to that, especially since they don't make any sound, so there wasn't any other cue that they were present.
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Apostle Chaos Lt. General (0.9.9.7)
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Check out my Youtube channel for videos of me playing DRL!  :)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXOijubEijdnrOja0kxXTKQ/videos

Tormuse

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Re: The Inferno Module
« Reply #137 on: May 07, 2022, 16:27 »

I made another attempt.  I made a concerted effort to push through Acheron this time, pressing forward faster than was wise, and burning through three med packs in the process, but the enemies were still reviving faster than I could kill them.  I had a plasmatic shotgun to help with corpse disposal, but it seems that the corpses that spawn in the river are undestroyable, so there's no way to stop the Arch-Viles from surrounding themselves with raised enemies, and I couldn't get close enough to them to even injure them, let alone kill them.

By the way, one thing I forgot to mention, but in the previous game, you may notice that I got 5 Shambler kills.  That's because (apparently) the switch that summons the Shambler can be activated as many times as you want.  I'm not sure if that's a particularly wise thing to do, but I thought I'd mention it in case it's a bug.  (Come to think of it, I didn't check if they each give you experience;  hmm...)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
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Apostle Chaos Lt. General (0.9.9.7)
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Check out my Youtube channel for videos of me playing DRL!  :)
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tehtmi

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Re: The Inferno Module
« Reply #138 on: May 07, 2022, 23:03 »

it seems that the corpses that spawn in the river are undestroyable

I guess this is a bug. I think they actually are theoretically destroyable, but their hp gets reset each time they move. I should be able to fix it though. (There used to be no way to do this correctly back when I first did this, but at some point I remember asking Kornel to add a way for mods to deal with tile HP, but I forget to use it here. Also possible that back when I original wrote this stuff that DRL wasn't correctly setting HP at all so corpses might have had 0 HP, although I don't remember for sure...)

Quote
By the way, one thing I forgot to mention, but in the previous game, you may notice that I got 5 Shambler kills.  That's because (apparently) the switch that summons the Shambler can be activated as many times as you want.  I'm not sure if that's a particularly wise thing to do, but I thought I'd mention it in case it's a bug.  (Come to think of it, I didn't check if they each give you experience;  hmm...)

Yes, this is a bug :)

Also, some answers from earlier posts I hadn't addressed yet.

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I didn't realize that this mod adds extra assemblies until the end, when I happened to glance at the assembly screen.  I stumbled across the Scout Armour assembly by accident, by putting random mods on my armour.  I never figured out what the "targeting system online" message meant, though.

I sort of forgot about the assemblies. These were added from a very early version back when vanilla DRL probably had fewer assemblies as well. I think I was trying to have them affect different things to give interesting choices. I think I had the recipes listed in a spoiler in the main post (since there is no real way to find them except trial and error which is sort of silly), but it got edited out at some point (probably an accident). If you want to see the recipes, I think they're still listed at the bottom of the readme file.

The effect isn't supposed to be very secret either, but I'll spoiler it in case you want to try to find out for yourself.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

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I discovered that getting melee kills while invisible (like with using the Shadow Aegis) doesn't wake enemies up!

I don't think I intended this, but not sure if I want to fix it... Maybe I should. (Melee probably doesn't need the help I guess?)

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I was four kills shy of YAAM, thanks to some guys that spawned during my fight with the Simulacrum.  *Sigh...*  :|

I put this on my list to fix.

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I don't know if anyone is still maintaining this mod, but I see a couple of minor errors.  The final kill count is correct, but the in-game kill count from the @ screen got messed up when I went down one of the blue stairs while there were still enemies on the level.  It showed 23 unkilled enemies for the rest of the game, even though I killed everything.

Yes, this is another thing that is sort of unfixable for now. The @ screen kill count was new (in 0.9.9.7 IIRC?) and broke a bunch of weird stuff Inferno was doing with enemies (similar to the issue with spectres messing up the kill count, although that was fixable). Final kill count is correct because Inferno was expecting to get around this issue by just ignoring the game's kill counting and doing everything itself, but @ screen kind of ruined that. There will probably be a future version of Inferno that runs against a new build of DRL that might fix this.

Quote
Also, I notice that I'm credited as getting the Betrayal Token twice.

I also made a note to fix this.


Probably won't have time this weekend, but I'm being inspired a little bit, so I'll try to get out some updates pretty soon. I have some updates from last year as well that I haven't uploaded yet (a little bit of level generation stuff, and also making the mod work properly with "0.9.9.8 beta" AKA the open source GitHub version).
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Tormuse

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Re: The Inferno Module
« Reply #139 on: May 08, 2022, 14:57 »

I guess this is a bug. I think they actually are theoretically destroyable, but their hp gets reset each time they move.

In my game, neither rockets nor plasma shotgun were able to destroy them.  If there was a way to destroy them, short of letting them get revived and killing them somewhere else, to destroy the corpse there, I didn't discover it.

I sort of forgot about the assemblies...

Okay, I'm glad I looked those up.  They're so hyper-specific, that even through trial and error, I would never have found them, not the least because mod packs simply don't drop frequently enough to allow that kind of experimentation.  I look forward to seeing if I can try some of them out.  :)

I don't think I intended this, but not sure if I want to fix it... Maybe I should. (Melee probably doesn't need the help I guess?)

I kind of like the effect;  the concept of doing stealth melee kills appeals to me.  It's up to you whether or not that deserves a change, but yeah, it's probably worth keeping in mind that currently, the game is hugely unbalanced in favour of melee.

If you'd like to give ranged builds a significant, but not unbalancing, buff, I would suggest allowing revived corpses in Acheron to drop ammo.  That level is a relative breeze for melee that doesn't have to care about ammo, but for a ranged build, going up against unlimited enemies with limited ammo is not fun.  If I could at least restock along the way, I'd have a fighting chance.  I mean it would still be a grisly war of attrition, where the only actual progress is made if you can manage to injure an Arch-Vile, but it would at least be feasible.
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Apostle Chaos Lt. General (0.9.9.7)
[26/26/26/26/18/9]
Check out my Youtube channel for videos of me playing DRL!  :)
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXOijubEijdnrOja0kxXTKQ/videos
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