DoomRL > Modding
[Design] DukeRL
yaflhdztioxo:
I've never played any dukes beyond 1 2 and 3D but I can offer the following observations:
General:
* Don't get too hung up on being true to game. Duke Nukem's not really a reality based series anyway.
Boots as weapons and equipment:
* Not possible, though it MAY be possible to add melee damage bonuses with the OnEquip and OnRemove hooks
Pistols:
* Don't make the base pistol too powerful. Duke's main pistol is pretty weak in 3D. 45s are nice but standard fare. Desert Eagles which I'm assuming the Golden Eagle is a reference to are pretty standard FPS fare ever since Counter-Strike but since it's Duke by all means go for flash. None of them fire the same cartridge so don't refer to them by real names.
Other:
* I can't think of any way for you to make use of pipe bombs. You can't force-fire a weapon and you can't manually aim either, so 'throwing' them simply won't work. Same goes for the tripmine.
* The shrink ray MIGHT be possible but we are talking some rather outrageous hacks to abuse that state.
* We've been asking for bouncing projectiles for years :). It's nae gonna happen.
Powerups:
* It should be possible to flag a being as dying due to freezethrower with clever use of the OnHitBeing hook to set the property and regular being act hooks to clear it. You'd have to structure all of your enemies and your entire mod around the structure though; maybe someone has a better idea.
* Holoduke would require custom AIs for every being. Certainly doable.
* Perhaps if the jetpack were a weapon you could 'fire' yourself a few tiles ahead? May not be possible, but that's the only way I can see it ever working.
Armor:
* Not a bad idea. You need an armor mechanic of some sort and that fits well.
Faking death:
* Tricky to do. I don't know what all you can change on an already spawned being but I'm guessing it's more than you can change for a cell. You could try respawning enemies on occasion or you could possibly try dressing up an enemy to make it look dead. It may not be worth the trouble though.
Assault Captain:
* You can cloak these guys. Teht has vays. You could also teleport them. Both would require AI tweaks and both could work well.
Octabrain:
* Limited range missiles ARE possible.
Babes:
* Here's the holy grail--effective civilians that you can interact with. If you make them a being you'll have to make an NPC AI that interacts with the player when next to them (the closest approximation to 'use' we have). You'll also have to juggle the kill statistics in order to properly not count them as legitimate kills BUT they'll always end up targeted by default in fire mode; there's no way to make them non-real targets that I know of. Conversely you can make them a usable cell, or have THEM be a non-usable cell that is always placed next to a usable cell which mimics the regular floor. It can get complicated... But this strategy effectively makes them like unmovable, interactive barrels.
Klear:
--- Quote from: yaflhdztioxo on December 11, 2012, 18:15 ---General:
* Don't get too hung up on being true to game. Duke Nukem's not really a reality based series anyway.
--- End quote ---
Sure, my aim is to make it *feel* as close to the game as possible. What I love about DoomRL is how doomy it is, somehow.
--- Quote ---Boots as weapons and equipment:
* Not possible, though it MAY be possible to add melee damage bonuses with the OnEquip and OnRemove hooks
--- End quote ---
I never really thought that the boots would be used as weapons. I'd go the route of not having any melee weapons in the game per se, and the boots improving the attack you get when you run into enemies.
--- Quote ---Pistols:
* Don't make the base pistol too powerful. Duke's main pistol is pretty weak in 3D. 45s are nice but standard fare. Desert Eagles which I'm assuming the Golden Eagle is a reference to are pretty standard FPS fare ever since Counter-Strike but since it's Duke by all means go for flash. None of them fire the same cartridge so don't refer to them by real names.
--- End quote ---
That is a matter of balance and has to wait for what I come up with as traits as well, but in any case Duke's basic pistol seems a bit more powerful than Doomguys', so I'd like to reflect that.
--- Quote ---Other:
* I can't think of any way for you to make use of pipe bombs. You can't force-fire a weapon and you can't manually aim either, so 'throwing' them simply won't work. Same goes for the tripmine.
--- End quote ---
I was imagining it to work similar to when you throw knives in DoomRL. Being able to use them from the inventory would be a plus.
--- Quote ---* The shrink ray MIGHT be possible but we are talking some rather outrageous hacks to abuse that state.
--- End quote ---
Let's hope it is. It wouldn't be the same without it.
--- Quote ---* We've been asking for bouncing projectiles for years :). It's nae gonna happen.
--- End quote ---
Pity...
--- Quote ---Powerups:
* It should be possible to flag a being as dying due to freezethrower with clever use of the OnHitBeing hook to set the property and regular being act hooks to clear it. You'd have to structure all of your enemies and your entire mod around the structure though; maybe someone has a better idea.
--- End quote ---
Let's hope so.
--- Quote ---* Holoduke would require custom AIs for every being. Certainly doable.
--- End quote ---
Holoduke is essential if the tripmines and pipebombs are to be useful for making traps. I'd really like to see it working.
--- Quote ---* Perhaps if the jetpack were a weapon you could 'fire' yourself a few tiles ahead? May not be possible, but that's the only way I can see it ever working.
--- End quote ---
Wouldn't be possible to make, for example, an item which works the same as phase device, but you are allowed to choose where to teleport when using it? If not, well, that's a problem.
--- Quote ---Armor:
* Not a bad idea. You need an armor mechanic of some sort and that fits well.
--- End quote ---
Thanks. I'll need to flesh it out then.
--- Quote ---Faking death:
* Tricky to do. I don't know what all you can change on an already spawned being but I'm guessing it's more than you can change for a cell. You could try respawning enemies on occasion or you could possibly try dressing up an enemy to make it look dead. It may not be worth the trouble though.
--- End quote ---
How is respawning handled on N!? I was hoping there would be a way to enable the script just for a single corpse. I really should just learn how DoomRL works. It would make everything a little easier.
--- Quote ---Assault Captain:
* You can cloak these guys. Teht has vays. You could also teleport them. Both would require AI tweaks and both could work well.
Octabrain:
* Limited range missiles ARE possible.
--- End quote ---
Great.
Zalminen:
Oo, I really need to dig up Duke 3D again so I can better comment on this thread.
I used to love the game but it's been ages since I last played it... but I'd definitely play DukeRL, that much is certain.
Motorheadbanger:
--- Quote from: Klear on December 12, 2012, 06:09 ---an item which works the same as phase device, but you are allowed to choose where to teleport when using it
--- End quote ---
Homing phase?
Equality:
Sorry, but IMO DukeRL is NOT the same as Duke3D. As a DoomRL is not the same as Doom. And some things can not be transferred.
--- Quote ---Holoduke
--- End quote ---
- no, because actors are not static and doing the same on pre-compiled levels. If levels builds dynamically and random, and actors (monsters) are walking randomly in undiscovered areas, then tripwires and holoduke are not used in that way as Duke3D, or we need something another. Specific for RL version. Giftdropping?
--- Quote ---Faking death
--- End quote ---
- ehm, the same as previous. may be "unconscious state" - not dead and can wake up eventually?
--- Quote ---jetpack
--- End quote ---
- no, because no 3D in RL version. May be special phase devices "teleport to 6 cells in chosen directions" for accessing some areas? may be something like "noclip for 6 turns" ? but not a jetpack as it was in Duke3D.
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