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[BDR]

Basic concept: Enemies respawn like in N! but only a certain number of times depending on the level of difficulty.  However, you must have a 100% kill count on all ordinary levels or else you will not be able to go down the stairs ("You feel the presence of life drawing you up and away from the stairwell..").  Special levels will need to be handled differently; I'm thinking that a good policy might be that if you kill one enemy in an area like the UC or the Wall then you must go on to kill them all, or you can avoid them entirely by simply going to the stairs ("You quickly descend to the next level before the stench of life overwhelms you..").  Of course, for a perfect game you'll avoid them altogether, but some may want to visit different areas anyway.  It could also be that you have to choose between killing everything or avoiding everything on all the levels, but that doesn't seem to have quite the same bite as needing a 100% kill count even with only limited respawning to proceed. :P

Thoughts?

[Styro]

That sounds like a really fun idea. You would have to spawn way more ammo than normal, though.

[TFoN]

I think it's a good idea, but drop the rising from the dead part. Raise the spawn-count, it's more straight-forward and doesn't spoil the unique feel of N!.

As for special levels, anyone who will qualify for this challenge will certainly be aware of what's down the rabbit's hole, and if they choose to go on, let them deal with it.

That sounds like a really fun idea. You would have to spawn way more ammo than normal, though.

Captain/Commando farming should be enough.
But, then again, you read what I think :) That should also take most of the bite off ammo requirements.

[BDR]

Ok, then.  50-150% more enemies than normal (100% monster count = normal game, 150% = AoD on M, 200% on H, and 250% on UV) depending on the difficulty, and you have to kill every single enemy on a level to go on to the next, no exceptions.  I'd make N! 300%, but I think with the respawning it'd be nigh-impossible to achieve a 100% kill count win as it is anyway (I bet Blade would love a challenge like this though ;P).

EDIT: Those numbers aren't set in stone, though... >_>

[Aki]

How would we unlock it?

[BDR]

Lieutenant or Captain seems about the right level to unlock it; definitely not lower than Sergeant or higher than Major though.

[TFoN]

25% jumps (from 125% ITYTD) make a little more sense to me. Each difflvl's anyway harder than it's predecesor.
UV at 250%'s a challenge enough as it is, when you enter dlvl2 with a shotgun, but are surrounded by captains and demons up to your neck. Plus having to kill them all...?
And N! should, IMO, have no increase, or a very slight one (25%). They all have to be dead when you go down the stairs, right? That's a perfect picture of hell for ya' :P

Major seems right, accessed together with AoMs.
Both have the same "iron grip" flavour of radical expectations and few exceptions.

[BDR]

I don't think challenge modes allow you to choose ITYTD as a difficulty :/.  But I did think of 25% jumps between levels first; just didn't think it really bit hard enough ;P.  150% for NTR, 175% for HMP, and 200% for UV it is then.  I agree N! doesn't really need an increase thanks to the 100% kill count requirement and the constant respawning.

One other idea:  I think somehow it would be mighty strange if someone got a mortem like this...

--------------------------------------------------------------
 DoomRL (v.0.9.8.5) roguelike post-mortem character dump
--------------------------------------------------------------

 Doomguy, level x Imp Sergeant, killed by a Angel of Death.
 on level xx of the Phobos base.
 He survived x turns and scored x points.
 He didn't like it too rough.

 He killed xxx out of xxx hellspawn. (xx%)
 He was an Angel of Death!
 [snip]

Is it just me?  Do we need/could we get a different special level for this challenge?  Or is this just signaling the need for a name change (:sigh: Angel of Death is just so catchy though.. would anything else really work?)?

[Adral]

Is it just me?  Do we need/could we get a different special level for this challenge?  Or is this just signaling the need for a name change (:sigh: Angel of Death is just so catchy though.. would anything else really work?)?

What about Angel of Massacre? Angel of Extermination, perhaps?

[Blade]

(I bet Blade would love a challenge like this though ;P).

I surelly will!))

[TFoN]

I don't think challenge modes allow you to choose ITYTD as a difficulty :/

Yeah, I noticed my stupid mistake a few hours after I logged off :P


Why shouldn't there be 2 Angels of Death, who may occasionaly duke it out? You kill the UC one multiple times anyway.
I'd thought about it when I read the title the first time, and it worked out for me just fine.
There're generals in opposing armies, too.

[GenTechJ]

I like Angel of Extermination personally...purge the unclean! :D

[yuriks]

Angel of Death seems like a really good name. And idea too.

[xwdishere]

Nice idea. I'd support this since I'm always trying to get 100% anyway. :P
If you're not going to go with Angel of Death, I'm leaning more towards Angel of Extermination.

[BDR]

Well, I *do* like Angel of Death.. I suppose it wouldn't matter too much about being named the same thing; those going for the UC in AoD would be mighty rare folks anyway (Blade, and maybe.... uhm... well, there's gotta be someone else crazy enough to try for 100% with a character that has some/all melee focus..).

[Styro]

Ok, then.  50-150% more enemies than normal (100% monster count = normal game, 150% = AoD on M, 200% on H, and 250% on UV) depending on the difficulty, and you have to kill every single enemy on a level to go on to the next, no exceptions.  I'd make N! 300%, but I think with the respawning it'd be nigh-impossible to achieve a 100% kill count win as it is anyway (I bet Blade would love a challenge like this though ;P).

EDIT: Those numbers aren't set in stone, though... >_>

I'd like to see the extra spawn count as a seperate challenge in addition to the one discussed here - Angel of Mayhem or something. You don't have to get a 100% kill count, but every level has 200%-300% of the normal number of enemies spawned. The thought of having the level just crawling with enemies is pretty appealing.

This, of course gave me the idea of being able to pick multiple challenges, if we had a seperate challenge for higher spawncount and for 100% kills. That would also allow you to play a Darkness, Haste, Berzerk challenge. Hehe :)

[BDR]

[snip]

This, of course gave me the idea of being able to pick multiple challenges, if we had a seperate challenge for higher spawncount and for 100% kills. That would also allow you to play a Darkness, Haste, Berzerk challenge. Hehe :)

Being able to combine challenges would be fun, and it would give people who've mastered the game (currently only Blade would fit this description >_>) plenty more to do.  I don't think combining them should unlock anything, though, or at least not what you'd get unlocked if you played through one challenge normally (this could potentially make it far too easy to achieve higher skill ranks, by say combining Angel of Haste with all of your challenges for instance).

I'll get to the rest of your ideas later. >_>

[Valkeera]

Um, I don't like the idea of picking up multiple challenges much... I view a challenge game as something unique, and a combination of them would subtract somewhat from its essence and spirit.

[TFoN]

I disagree.
Challenge combinations can make for some really tricky, unique games.
AoI+AoP'll be really nice ;P
The suggested AoVampirism/Disease+AoB could be great.
And AoB/Mr+AoD would be a perfect game for the veterans!

[Aki]

AoMrk+AoMs+AoLT.
'Nuff said =p

[TFoN]

Much pain :P

But AoMr+AoMs should do almost the same, IMO.
Either way there's ammo space aplenty. PDs are too rare to really consider.
Armor space's the only real problem... But, then again, what a problem it is :)

[Aki]

Lets see blade try these:
A) AoMrk+AoMs+AoI or AoP
B) AoMrk+AoMs+AoLT.
C)AoMrk+AoMs+AoLT+AoI+AoD+AoP.

[TFoN]

Actually, AoMs in C makes the game easier by Supercharging on level-up. Without it, you're stuck with what you start with (plus 30 possible HPs from Ironman(3) :P ). Heheheh.

[BDR]

And AoB/Mr+AoD would be a perfect game for the veterans!

I would love to try AoMr in this example.  Pistols + SoaG = a lot of fun.  Of course, the farthest I've come to winning the game anyway is level 22... (which was a very stupid death considering I had about 8 or 9 medpacks >_<)

[BDR]

Really, though, I think that if the 'make your own challenge mode' is put in it should by all means be completely optional (no combos are required to unlock anything) and no games within the mode will count towards any requirements for player file advancement (as in Sergeant, Demon, etc., no matter what you're doing).  That way, it's always just for fun and the bragging rights you get out of having a character win while being compulsively an angel many times over, and those who don't want to have anything to do with mixing challenges can easily ignore it.