DoomRL > Discussion

Jackhammer with MAc?

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skarczew:

--- Quote from: Evilpotatoe on June 05, 2013, 15:24 ---On MAC builds, it would be just too powerful... 5 shells at the cost of one ? ... are you serious ?
Adding chainfire to it, tough, would be useless. 2/3/4 means it wouldn't fire faster unless you're MAC (you'd need to reload too fast), so the only use would be to spare some ammo. Maybe just add an alternate fire (the curren one, firing 3 shells), and make it's default attack a normal one ?

--- End quote ---
Maybe too powerful, but making MAc build just for one shotgun sounds like a ...you know.
On the other side, it still got very small ammo magazine, and has drawbacks explained earlier in the previous posts.

And if you say that it is too powerful, then what would you say about modded Plasma Rifle, or Hyperblaster?

Sereg:
Heh... those are nothing. You should have seen the F2N1S1T1 laser rifle I was rolling with the other day(until I found a nightmare arachnotron cave >.<) - one burst for all normal enemies, two for big nightmares and shamblers/lava elementals.

Essentially, MAc will already result in monstrously powerful items. Adding one more, which can't be N modded, can only be used at close range, and most effective if the target is pinned, isn't going to break anything, especially when that item has very limited uses without MAc(meaning, at all, right now). It's also worth noting, as skarczew mentioned, that no one will be building MAc just for jackhammer, unless it spawns very, very early. If they find it in addition to a MAc build, nice for them. So is a nuclear plasma rifle. So is a laser rifle. So is a minigun. So is a nano pack. So is a firestorm pack. If they find it without the MAc build, then it will be no different then it is right now.

Evilpotatoe:

--- Quote from: skarczew on June 06, 2013, 04:10 ---Maybe too powerful, but making MAc build just for one shotgun sounds like a ...you know.
--- End quote ---

I didn't speak of taking MAc only for it, but improving from an (already extremely powerful) plasma gun with mediocre accuracy and 1d7 * 6 damages, consuming plasma, to a 3d8 * 5 area weapon which never misses and just needs some shells sounds like a quite big leap.
So in fact, yes, it probably would deserve picking the skill just for it.

I agree, modded plasma rifles and hyperblaster are insane, especially with unlimited ammo, but I quit them for a scout build currently.
Intuition seems better than MAc to me when you don't have 2devination skills to locate monsters.


--- Quote from: Sereg on June 06, 2013, 08:43 ---Heh... those are nothing. You should have seen the F2N1S1T1 laser rifle I was rolling with the other day
--- End quote ---
You're comparing an Ao666 weapon with a regular drop...
Sure, I prefer my usual S2B3 nuclear plasma rifles to most unique weapons, but one of the major difference caracterizing uniques is that they are powerful right out-of-the-box !
No need to wait for a ton of stupid mods to use them... just take a shell box, and your Jackhammer will pwn asses
I don't think Jackhammer is a bad weapon. For me, it just consumes too much shells, but it's still great for AoSh, and certainly also as a big area damage dealer, for some uses.
I personally prefer regular shotguns, but I wouldn't say it suck, really. It deals insane damages. I just see it as a situationnal weapon.

skarczew:

--- Quote from: Evilpotatoe on June 06, 2013, 12:58 ---I didn't speak of taking MAc only for it, but improving from an (already extremely powerful) plasma gun with mediocre accuracy and 1d7 * 6 damages, consuming plasma, to a 3d8 * 5 area weapon which never misses and just needs some shells sounds like a quite big leap.
So in fact, yes, it probably would deserve picking the skill just for it.

--- End quote ---
But the thing is, almost nobody would make MAc on AoSh.
Simple A2 modded Plasma Rifle would hit often enough to outdamage Jackhammer. Add more mods, traits, damage drop due to a range, armor (should I mention that plasma is better for this?), bigger magazine ...


--- Quote ---Sure, I prefer my usual S2B3 nuclear plasma rifles to most unique weapons, but one of the major difference caracterizing uniques is that they are powerful right out-of-the-box !
No need to wait for a ton of stupid mods to use them... just take a shell box, and your Jackhammer will pwn asses

--- End quote ---
I tried it once in CoS. I had to switch to Elephant Gun and Plasma Rifle because Jack ate 3 shell boxes. True story.


--- Quote ---I don't think Jackhammer is a bad weapon. For me, it just consumes too much shells, but it's still great for AoSh, and certainly also as a big area damage dealer, for some uses.
I personally prefer regular shotguns, but I wouldn't say it suck, really. It deals insane damages. I just see it as a situationnal weapon.

--- End quote ---
"Something is not bad." "I use other stuff anyway." <-- I see some contradiction here :P

Arena Master's Staff is not bad. It is just a situational equipment too.
And for some reason people want to change it, too. Why? Because it is situational?

Klear:
Jackhammer really shines in those late levels packed with nothing but formers. I once got three such levels in a row. It was awesome!

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