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Master trait discussion 1: Gunrunner

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Eyro:
2birds basically summed up my thoughts.

I'm finding I like Gunrunner more and more as my "Main Master". It's incredibly fun to use as it can get you out of a tight spot like nothing else, but use it badly and you'll turn a corner with 3 lave barrels in front of you and a imp just chillin' off to the side.

Aki:

--- Quote from: 2birds1stone on September 16, 2013, 20:10 ---That's odd, I was under the impression that Gunrunner meant no accuracy penalties while running, but neither the wiki nor the game actually state this. I don't recall an embarrassing miss-rate with rocket launchers, but memory's fallible.

Small health globes are the single most likely item to spawn in the game; there are enough other healing items (including invulnerability globes) that I'd be very surprised if you couldn't enter sprint at least twice a level. The idea of Gunrunner isn't to spend entire levels rampaging, it's to pick your rampage times well; in this way, it's a very skill-based mastery. It's useful for those awkward moments when you don't have any cover and just need to dodge around a little while you shoot yourself an escape route. It's useful for moving from a terrible spawn to an easily defendable position. It's fantastic for the Mortuary, and most of the boss fights. It makes absolute mincemeat of Arch-Viles (which Gun Kata can't do so well, seeing as Arch-Vile attacks aren't dodged).

Gunrunner, a bit like an invulnerability globe, allows you to get yourself pretty much anywhere on the map in complete safety. Assuming you have an eye for positioning, this is going to guarantee map clear almost every time.

--- End quote ---

I tend to do great on Vs once I get Gun Kata. But that's probably because by that point they're just fodder in front of the cleric. Hue hue hue.

I've done a few runs today but haven't had much luck with shitty spawns or luck or impatience getting me a YASD before I could actually pick up the trait. I'm going to give it another go before I comment any more though.

Sambojin:
Just a few rambling thoughts on comments posted. MSh is a shotgun build, but it's also a fairly generalist shotgun build. Being able to quick-switch to any weapon instantly, SM available for RLs/MLs and not too many other handy traits blocked, all make it a good "any weapon at any time" build, with shotguns having priority.
 
As mentioned, MGR is great with SM. It's also great with bulk-modded MLs. There's more MLs in the game now. Make of that what you will (weapon/quick switch is a fine thing). It's also not bad in "oh shit" situations with a bulked-BFG.

Pistols, shotguns, RLs, MLs and BFGs all working with a master-trait? Sounds pretty generalist to me. None of these weapons actually have priority due to the master-trait, you just tend to use your shotgun more often.
 
It almost makes a micro-launcher seem feasible. Which is a good thing.

Not only are shell boxes ace with MGR, so are rocket packs and plasma batteries. In the right situation of course.

15 extra turns of running is actually pretty nice. Nicer with SM, but it's not a bad thing to reposition/reload either (which is exactly where the trait falls apart without SM). There's plenty of extra running time available, you just have to approach it more like a melee/AoB type game, where medipacks and globes are more like pep-pills than actual health recovery items. If you can do it with a chainsaw, you can definitely do it with a shotgun/ML/BFG.
 

Sambojin:
Some other thoughts on MGR specifically:

You may have made a "weakish" build of it, but not necessarily. Even one level of EE makes all the "big-kaboom" weapons better. Rel-Rel-SM is awesome as well. Strangely enough, I'd probably either lead with SM, or Jug->SM, with dodgemaster and the master-trait just being icing on the cake. Juggler is a mini-master-trait of it's own, sacrificing backpack space for extreme flexibility (it's right up there with Int(2) in my opinion).

Are you abusing the hell out of Juggler? In this version of the game it gives you the next LOADED weapon from your backpack. It's fiddly and time consuming to do, but you can have the "backpack full of shotties" effect going. Carry a shotgun as your primary. Carry a RL as your secondary. Carry a pistol in your backpack. Carry many more loaded shotguns in your backpack. Move/fire with MGR whilst running, free-switch to pistol (press 2), free-switch to shotgun (press 3). You now have the next loaded shotgun from your backpack in your hands. It works as long as you have 3 weapon types available (one primary with backups, a different secondary, a third "switcher" weapon in your inventory).

So, collect shotguns. Then combat shotties. Then RLs. Then MLs. Then BFGs. Mod them all in the best ways possible. Basically, it's a strange upgrade path to "on-tap" firepower for the cost of a few inventory slots.

It's abusing a mechanic, but the free-switch of Juggler was specifically changed in this version to allow this (and to not grab the next unloaded weapon, like previous versions). Maybe not for this use, but it was changed to grab the weapon with the most ammo available.

Does this make MGR more feasible? Yep. Very much so. Start a weapon collection, it's worth it.

Another point, does everyone have their MLs bound to a quick-switch key? If not, do so immediately. It's very useful with Juggler (even though the OP died on the ML getting level, the point still stands).

Sylph:
I know I'm a touch late to the part here (I've been away) but I feel people in this thread are writing off the pistol-using ability of this trait too much.

I wouldn't call it a shotgun-centric master trait. it's true that it's probably most focused on shotgun use, but I find it great with pistols, too. A few A mods, or EE, in combination with SOAG, and using juggler to keep your pistol/combat pistol loaded, is very powerful.
Of *COURSE* it's not as powerful as Gunkata, but gunkata only works with pistols, this trait works with shotguns and rocketlaunchers (as discussed) which makes it superior in a non-AoMr pistol-based build, and I think this point is key. You can still take SOAG outside of AoMR, and it works very well with this trait.

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