Jupiter Hell > General Discussion

Design Rant : Inventory

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Uitë:
Inventory tetris never bothered me all that much. For me, the way I play these kinds of games have two distinct phases: action and scavenging. While in ‘action’ mode, all that really matters is ammo and health. After I've secured an area scavenging mode kicks in and inventory management has always been a big part of that, so conceptually it doesn't break the flow of the game at all for me.

As for how to handle dropped items, I'd like to ask what the rationale is behind allowing players to revisit previous levels. Without that, keeping items laying around and wiping them as you leave the level is no issue at all.

I also like the idea of simply having max ammo counts, and not bothering with placing the ammo in your inventory. It's very doomish.

Kornel Kisielewicz:
Ok, some general answers. I'll be posting rationale for a couple of stuff, any attempt to change the decisions must address that rationale -- just saying that "I don't like something" is not enough.

Tetris inventory

There are a couple of reasons for this choice.


* Not the least important reason is that it's a well known solution that people instinctively know and will immediately know how to work with. It has been successfully used in many titles that require a lot more fast paced interface than our turn-based game.
* I plan to address some issues that I often have with such interfaces in other games. Namely there will be a toggleable option to autofit items (seems as most UI programmers never heard of "dynamic programming" -_-), secondly, the rotate option will obviously be there for use.
* This style of interface allows for a quick view of all the items even if there's a lot of them. Compared to most list interfaces this allows for a much quicker feedback on one's inventory (compare the list interfaces in Mass Effect or Fallout, or the terrible terrible item UI of Skyrim), and a quick info on storage space left.
* Dedicated ammo containers will prevent quick overflow of the inventory space with spare ammo.
* This interface works naturally with a slot based equipment system.
* We will take special care to have all the items easily identifiable, by using border colors for item type, most important numeric stat on the icon itself, and full information on hover.
Boxed ammo

The fixed amount of ammo boxes prevents a quick overflow of the inventory with basic ammo, which prevents constant throwing away ammo in the early game. By the mid game, the valued ammo will be of the type that is not easily available, and other items will also rise in importance. Also, this will allow us to do X/Y ammo counts on the main HUD. Also, if you find ammo of a sort that you already have, the game wont even tell you that you don't have space left - hence, no frustration ;] (and works because of item destruction on drop).

Items on floor

There are a couple of reasons for this choice.


* Any solution that leaves items on floor pushes people towards optimizing carried items at level exit by boring backtracking of their steps and filling up inventory with junk.
* It doesn't make much sense to leave opening containers for later, as you barely will use up items in your inventory (due to ammo boxes, spent ammo doesn't free up space) -- you also have no idea what a given container/corpse will hold.
* Backtracking is enabled to allow for more complex quests. Auto-travel however will exist to speed up any longer journey through explored space. Also, some levels will change on return, or have places that are inaccessible earlier.
* The game will prompt the player before item "destruction", this system was used in many games (also online) and I havn't heard much complaints about the destruction being final.
* Items on floor introduce clutter, and foggen what is actually happening.
* Items on floor also introduce interface complexities that could be fully avoided.
* The general rationale is "you go forward and leave what you don't need behind"

Thiebs:
I like the first two parts a lot. But here are my thoughts on the last section:

--- Quote from: Kornel Kisielewicz on January 26, 2014, 06:25 ---
* Any solution that leaves items on floor pushes people towards optimizing carried items at level exit by boring backtracking of their steps and filling up inventory with junk.
* It doesn't make much sense to leave opening containers for later, as you barely will use up items in your inventory (due to ammo boxes, spent ammo doesn't free up space) -- you also have no idea what a given container/corpse will hold.
* Backtracking is enabled to allow for more complex quests. Auto-travel however will exist to speed up any longer journey through explored space. Also, some levels will change on return, or have places that are inaccessible earlier.
* The game will prompt the player before item "destruction", this system was used in many games (also online) and I havn't heard much complaints about the destruction being final.
* Items on floor introduce clutter, and foggen what is actually happening.
* Items on floor also introduce interface complexities that could be fully avoided.
* The general rationale is "you go forward and leave what you don't need behind"
--- End quote ---

* People will still try to carry as much as possible at all times to maximize their later options. It just means they'll be scavenging in a different manner, not that they won't be scavenging.
* To me, it seems like it would make it more important to save containers until I'd cleared out the area/level. I wouldn't want to open a container with a cool item only to have to ditch a medkit I'll be using in a few moments, or find a bunch of ammo in one, then a new container to hold it in another after the first one is exhausted. (This would be avoided if you could go back to containers, but that would just make for even more shuffling about.)
* I love every part of this point. :D
* This is also valid, I never thought accidentally loosing items would be an issue.
* True, but they can also add to a sense of realism, as bodies and fallen weapons go hand in hand, though this is a minor point.
* Very true, unfortunately. :(
* While I can suspend my disbelief if needed, this feels a little thin, since you'll be leaving things behind whether you destroy them or not, and I imagine a lot of people won't realize or appreciate that it was a conscious decision.And I feel it's worth stating again: The first two sections definitely have my vote, for what little that's worth! :P

Simon-v:
How about making the "tetris inventory" purely visual by making it auto-sort intelligently every time an item is picked up or discarded?

thelaptop:

--- Quote from: Simon-v on January 26, 2014, 12:11 ---How about making the "tetris inventory" purely visual by making it auto-sort intelligently every time an item is picked up or discarded?

--- End quote ---
Unless the sorting is stable, we will see the "dancing items" effect.

Also, some people remember placement of items, and having it purely visual and always auto-sorted will go against their perceptions at being able to tinker.  This may not be a good thing.

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