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Author Topic: Design Rant : Inventory  (Read 23760 times)

Sambojin

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #45 on: May 22, 2014, 19:16 »

(I'll make a different post for each section, the ideas don't need to be used together)

1-d weapon slots.

As noted, I like tetris inventories. But in a game like JH, it would seem weird to have a left/right hand slot, other stuff, and everything else is in the backpack. How many soldiers carry weapons and ammo and other crap in their backpack? Mostly its ammunition pouches for ammo, held/shoulder strapped/holstered/webbing for weapons/grenades, and other stuff in the backpack. Some stuff needs to be accessible quickly, some is in the pack.

So I think JH could use 3 different areas. Guns, ammo, backpack. Guns being a 1d list, ammo being pouch/slot based (as mentioned above) and then a slot or tetris based backpack. Why? Simplicity (even if it sounds complicated).

How many weapons should JHGuy (son of DoomGuy) be able to carry? All of them? Certainly more than a primary/secondary, but all of them, all at once? Probably not.

So give weapons a size, with a maximum amount of "size" to be carried. You have 10 "amount" to be carried, with a dual-wield able to be used for size 1 weapons. Primary/secondary gives faster switching.  Pistols, knives, grenades, etc are size 1, SMGs size 2, shotguns size 3, chainguns/RLs size 4, BFGs size 5. Whatever. Size will be a balance thing.

You can only carry weapons up to the maximum value. Traits/level-ups/armours may increase the allowable size limit, decrease the size a certain weapon class is (level into dual-weilding SMGs or shotguns!) or do all kinds of other things (switch speeds for specific sizes of weapons or types, etc). But it will handily provide a cap for the amount of weapons a player can carry at any given time without backpack size being king. Weapons should be independent of the amount of other stuff you can carry, otherwise backpack size = everything, which it shouldn't be.

Whilst I'm on about de-coupling various mechanics from each other, weapon size and weapon type don't need to be the same stat either. You can have size 4 beefy shotguns and size 3 "chaingun" assault rifles. And really big fucking guns. This ties into traits and builds as well as itemization and armour. Ammo plays a role as well, since a mini-gun sure does hold a lot of bullets, even if it's a bit bigger than a chain-gun, pistol or SMG.

Taken with the ideas on ammunition above, it doesn't railroad you into certain things, but it does limit them nicely. The starting ammo pouches/weapon-size values were arbitrarily picked, they're just an example.

(I've got heaps more to add to this one. I might do a mockup myself to show what I mean).
« Last Edit: May 22, 2014, 20:38 by Sambojin »
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Sambojin

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #46 on: May 22, 2014, 21:03 »

Traits/level ups.

While this may be a little off-topic, it does have bearing on the things I mentioned. I see JH as being a "larger" game than DoomRL, especially in it's levelling system. Rather than 9-12 choices in any given standard run, it might be more common to hit level 20 or 30 (or have 20-30 choices to make) by the time you finish the game.

This is a good thing. It offers not only a more controlled levelling system, it stops the "power-jumping" that is present in DoomRL. Some advanced or master traits are so different that you can go from average to godly in one level, where the ones before it felt incremental in power. It's a part of the game, it's good, but it doesn't have to be that way.

A faster, but more incremental levelling system can also allow for more synergies and build strategies than are immediately obvious. The amount of level-ups aren't really the problem, you could just as easily have 2 or 3 traits per level-up. But it would allow a more complex system to be used.

Which ties us back into inventory. I guess this is more of a question than a thought:

How much of the levelling/trait system is expected to be used on inventory buffs or item modding in JH?

I'm a fan of de-coupling mechanics, yet making them obvious to the player. I'm also a fan of synergies and unexpectedly powerful builds. Will there be items or traits to expand inventory size or use? I like my outlined thoughts above for such a system (as poorly explained as they are), but how much is set as "this is your character" and how much is changeable throughout play? Inventory is a big issue in this.
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Sambojin

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #47 on: May 22, 2014, 22:41 »

Anyway. End of thoughts, but I'll modify the above posts a fair bit over the next day or so. De-coupling both weapons and ammo from the backpack seems like a good option though.

Hmmmm. I'm going drinking until I remember what I was going to put in this post. Probably some stuff about levelling. Or mods. Maybe ammo. It was something profound that vaguely linked into it all. Might just be a placeholder for mock-ups.

There's traits, modding, and the backpack and all kinds of stuff still left though. Classes, itemization. The list goes on.....
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Svankensen

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #48 on: July 19, 2014, 04:55 »

I like the idea of a "pouch" mechanic. Simple and customizable depending on your weapon needs. Cause i have a single BIG gripe with the "weapon box" system as initialli proposed: RNG. Say you get dropped too little of some ammo boxes, but that constitutes your main weapon. You may be able to survive or work around it, but do you want the game to go that way? I think not. Thats what i disliked of SOTS: the pit (and i loved that game): Way too heavy RNG dependency. The setable pouches work nicely in that direction. I mean, ammo pouches would be common enough that they could be dropped without big worries, while the total quantity of them you carry is an important tactical decision. It also helps introduce some nice concepts easily, allowing for advanced stuff like for example an automated ammo glove. It reloads weapons almost instantly, but only fits 1 magazine (until you have time to reload the glove) and only for some ammo types (shells or energy based weapons, prolly).

Also, i do like the idea of being able to carry ammo in a suboptimal way, great if you are desperate for saving some rare ammo. Put it in one of your equipment slots. I was gonna say your off hand, but of course my mind went on and tought of a few interesting things that could relate to that concept. They may go against your design concepts tho, but i think you are smart enough to filter trough that. In the awesome game Space Station 13 you have a "back" slot, belt, Inner layer of clothes, outher layer (space suits, armor, coats). So, if you want to have a big oxygen tank, you must either hold it in one of your hands or in your back, so no backpack, just what you can store in your belt and pockets. So you could start the game with just an utility belt (who goes around with a backpack all day?) and maybe a good but oversized melee weapon that uses your backslot. Hell, maybe tank and blowtorch. Or you could find an energy backpack that stores a metric fuckton of power for one or another weapon. Excellent if you are near the endgame, you can abuse that plasma rifle or BFG. Will it last long enough? maybe youll find yourself saving ammo by using a belt weapon like a pistol or something. Also allows for suit changes with different pocket sizes and protections. Small strategic decisions like those.
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Trar

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #49 on: August 06, 2014, 21:39 »

I'm liking these ideas. I do agree there should be pouches, webbing and weapons separate from a backpack slot. I also like the idea of large ammo packs the player can wear on their back for certain weapons, but this would interfere with a backpack. The player could use a utility belt/webbing/fanny pack looted from the civilian dorms with, say, an energy backpack, but with less carrying capacity.

On an unrelated note, has anyone thought about whether there will be food in this game? Ration packs and so forth? Space marines gotta eat too.
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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #50 on: August 07, 2014, 10:02 »

On an unrelated note, has anyone thought about whether there will be food in this game? Ration packs and so forth? Space marines gotta eat too.

I think that is one of many bodily functions that will *not* be simulated in the game.
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Arron Syaoran

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2014, 22:28 »

I do like the Tetris+No Floor Items System, but only if selling items to a shop is not possible*. I've played Diablo 2, and one of the things I hated was doing 20 trips just to sell everything that dropped from the mobs I killed, especially since most items took up 1/4-1/3 of the inventory.
As for looting corpses/containers, have them still contain the items you failed to loot(because of full inventory) until you change dungeon levels. New containers of items should always spawn if any monsters respawn upon reentering the cleared level(but only if monsters respawn upon reentering).

*Note: Even though selling to a shop shouldn't be possible with the idea, Buying from a shop could still be available. Coinage should either take 1 inventory space per $5000/$8000/$20000(depending on wallet sizes) or be independent of inventory and take up no space. Wallets should be smaller in size than medpacks/ammo crates/weapons/armour for more money carrying versatility.

As for ammo pouches, I really love the idea, and believe that ammo pouches should be able to be set to a specific ammo type(reset causes destruction of ammo), but have some pouches better suited for 9mm than rockets, while others are better suited for rockets than 9mm(varying ammo type capacities depending on pouch).
Example: Pouch A can hold either 80 bullets, 20 shells or 5 rockets. Pouch B can hold either 40 bullets, 35 shells or 8 rockets. Pouch C can hold only 20 bullets, or 30 shells, or a whopping 15 rockets. Each pouch may only contain one ammo type at a time, and changing the ammo type will destroy any remaining ammo. Pouches A, B and C have different names to help hint at which pouch is best for which types of ammo.
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Kornel Kisielewicz

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #52 on: August 27, 2014, 16:10 »

Food is out - there'll be no hunger clock, but that is offset by the lack of natural healing. In later levels background corruption will also serve as a food clock.
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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #53 on: August 29, 2014, 05:05 »

Okay, so I'm a little late to the party, just learned about JH after getting that "I gotta go play some DoomRL" itch in my system. First off, really looking forward to some more info on the game, and I'm always glad when a dev takes time to not only inform the fan, but get feedback from us as well! Anyway, here's my thoughts....

1. Equipment and Inventory

Equipment/Inventory will function similarly to DoomRL, but with a different presentation (think the Diablo equipment screen), and with a couple more slots. The left/right hand, armor and boots slots stay, but additionally we'll have a head slot and two device slots (think hacking and electronics). Moreover, some equipment pieces will introduce their own slots -- weapons may have 1+ different mod slots (possibly an ammo slot if we go for different ammo), powered armor may have power and extension slots, etc. The big difference I plan however is that anything that is worn, still takes space in inventory. Why? Because similarly to Diablo, not all equipment will take the same amount of space, and this way we'll cut down on any equipment shuffling needed to swap items, and get rid of metagaming moves like carrying a huge item in your hand to save on inventory space. To balance this out, the inventory will be made bigger. Does this make sense? Will this introduce any problems? Any ideas on this front?

After reading 4 pages of back and forth on this, I've come up with a compromise. I really love the list based system of DoomRL, and while I've played a LOT of both Diablo and ResE4, I think I like the list system better. Especially if you want to make a fast paced game with little inventory management. The list system has the "Do I keep it or not?" question where as the slot system has the "Can I fit it in my pack?" question on top of if you want to keep it or not. I do like the slot system, but it does force players to spend a lot of time on that screen doing management. The graphical slot system also lends to conundrums such as "I have 10 slots available, but this 4x2 item can't fit anywhere because I don't have the right shape available." So what's my compromise? A listed slot base system. Not as confusing as it sounds. It'll act basically like a weight system in most regards. The items are listed in your inventory, along with how many slots they take up. Example: You have 40 slots available. The pistol takes up 4 slots, an ammo box takes of 2 slots, armor takes 6, helmet takes 4, boots take 4. You've used 20 slots used, so you have 20 left. This will also remove the confusion of having items still take up slots while they are equipped, as they can just be highlighted on the list and not look like it's 2 of the same item. It also allows items to use odd numbers of slots, like a rocket launcher taking up 5 slots and not just be a 1x5 box. As far as weapons/armor having mod/ammo slots, those can be implemented when equipped on the 3D doll. Equip a pistol that has 2 mod slots, then 2 mod slots appear next to the doll.

If you're dead set on using the grid system, go with your first instinct after seeing the ResE4 screenshot. The Mod slots can be inside the mod-able item, just like gems are in Diablo II & III. I also think mods should not take up space after being attached to a weapon. It's part of that weapon now, not just floating in the bag.

The suggestions different tabs for ammo/weapons/armor sounds pretty nice too if you're going to stick with a grid system.

Also, just as a side point, players are going to hoard as much as possible no matter what. Even more so with the "destruction on drop" mechanic I'll talk about later. Inventory management is always going to crop up one way or another. For something quick, simple and fast, tetris grids are not the way to go.

2. Ammo

This is a biggie. My initial need of reconstructing the inventory came from my happiness with the AliensRL system. And following it, I wanted to introduce set ammo counters like in AliensRL and Doom. However, this takes away a significant strategic challenge of balancing your ammo types, and balancing your ammo vs. consumables/spare weapons. However, with the DoomRL solution this becomes a constant game of micromanagement also, and swapping items a lot. So I need a solution that did include the strategy of ammo management, but took away the need of fiddling with a lot of items.

The solution I'm thinking about is having all ammo in something that is similar to current ammo boxes. You have a running total of your ammo, that is limited by the amount of ammo boxes you have. So if you have 3 boxes of shells, you can hold at most 3*50 shells. Any shells you find are automatically fit into the boxes, but you get a no-room message as soon as you run out of boxes. You can additionally find new boxes of course, but whether you add them to your inventory or not, this is your decision. Boxes also have different sizes, so e.g. a single box of rockets already takes up 2x3 of space.

Comments? Alternative solutions?

Personally, I really like this idea. Though I don't see the issue of "fiddling with a lot of item" in DoomRL. At most in it was "I have 400 9mm rounds. I can drop 100 to carry this medkit." While it did mean I had to go into my inventory, evaluate my ammo situation, and decide if I was going to drop anything, I never found it an issue. With this idea it goes from being a non-issue to non-existent. This also adds more of a survival aspect to the game. "I only have enough room for 30 shotgun shells. Do I really want to waste them on these humans, or use some of my 9mm rounds which I have over 100 rounds of?"

To prevent weapons from being useless by not having an ammo box of the correct type, all weapons should act as a ammo box themselves. It would be really bad to have to say "I could pick up this shotgun, but I don't have any shell boxes, so I can't pick up ammo until I find one." You could also have the weapons themselves count as only half a box. Example: Just having a shotgun in your inventory gives you a max of ammo count of 15 shells. When you pick up a shell box the max jumps to 45 shells. (Assuming shell boxes have a size of 30 shells.)

3. Ammo types

There have been requests for different ammo types for both AliensRL and DoomRL, but I always rejected them due to the added UI complexity. With graphics though, we have a couple more options, also the slot system outlined above would fit with different ammo types nicely. The only issue here is that with this system, you should have separate ammo boxes for separate ammo types, which obviously doesn't make much sense.

Having separate boxes for separate ammo types makes perfect sense. If shotguns can have buckshot, slugs, and explosive rounds, you would need 3 boxes to carry the different types of ammo. It would be the cost of having options. Though if you really only wanted one box to store all three ammo types, that's extremely easy to do as well. You're already going to have max ammo counts with the boxes, so just split ammo to the max count. Example: Assuming you have a shotgun and an ammo box for a max of 45 shells. If you have 20 buckshot shell and nothing else, then the display would read 20/45 Shells and underneath it would read 20 B | 0 S | 0 E (B, S, and E obviously being replaced by graphics for Buckshot, Slugs, and Explosives respectively.) Pick up 10 slugs and it would read 30/45 Shells | 20 B | 10 S | 0 E. After picking up 5 explosive rounds it would read 35/45 Shells | 20 B | 10 S | 5 E. Simple to read, no extra ammo boxes, no messy UI, even when it comes to dropping certain ammo types. Click the box, click drop ammo, select the ammo type, done.

4. Items on floor

Here's a biggie -- I think about removing items on floor altogether. Items can be found on (highlighted) corpses, lockers, boxes, etc. Dropped items get destroyed. This would prevent doing tedious stash micromanagement, and increase the pace of the game. Also, it'd work well with the boxes idea -- players wont be tempted to do tedious backtracking to get ammo they left behind and couldn't pick up. This is probably the most controversial decision, but it would (IMHO) benefit the game much. 

I'm not sure how I feel about this. I understand wanting to decrease micromanaging as much as possible to have a fast paced game but I'm not sure this is the way to go about it. As other have said, it goes from being a deliberate design choice to feeling incomplete and poorly executed. Also, how are containers going to work if a player doesn't take any or all items from that container? Will it be a "take it or loose it" type of interaction? That option also feels incomplete and poorly designed. I would absolutely hate to open one container and loose the 2 rocket boxes because I don't have a rocket launcher, only immediately find a rocket launcher afterwards. However, allowing a player to backtrack to a container nullifies your reason for having items being destroyed when dropped in the first place.
 
You did mentions that players would be able to return to areas that have been previously explored, and I completely understand wanting to remove the "Hey, I left that rocket ammo 3 floors back, let me go grab that now," scenario. I also understand the difficulty of adding a new UI for items being on the floor, along with new art for items being on the floor, etc. I do believe, however, that you should allow players to store items in a container until they leave the area. You can still have the dropped items get destroyed. This way you could avoid the "on the floor" UI, prevent tedious backtracking for left behind items, and explain it in the lore (someone already suggested minor demons looting the containers).

This also allows for a bit of strategy in a single area. Example: I'm in the barracks and there's a huge demon in here with me. I find a rocket launcher on a corpse, but I don't have the space to carry it. So I stash my pistol and ammo boxes on the corpse, take the rocket launcher, and use all the rockets on the big guy. I then go back to the corpse, stow the rocket launcher, grab my pistol and ammo back and move on to the next area, the med-bay. While I'm in the med-bay some scavenger demon comes and loots the rocket launcher I left behind, so I never see that rocket launcher again. Now I have no reason to backtrack to the barracks again unless it's for some story reason. (I also purposely didn't use the word "floor" because who says the game has to be vertical? Yeah, it works for DoomRL and most other Rouge-Likes, but area transitions can always just been a special door!)

I realize this example has all the "fiddling with items" that you wanted to avoid, but really, that's part of strategic game play. It's going to happen. Even in fast paced, full on "run-and-gun" action games like COD, you're going to drop your Uzi for a rocket launcher when a tank shows up. After the tank is gone, you're going to grab your Uzi again. The best you can do it make it painless as possible to switch between the items.

Also, as a side now, you said you that you specifically want to avoid players micromanaging, but the grid slot system for the inventory inherently forces a player to micromanage their items.

----------------------------------

Okay, I'm done now. Wow that's a long post. Well, I look forward to what everyone has to say about all my ideas and such. I spent a few hours just writing this. I was reworking and rewriting ideas as I was typing them.  You can really see it in that last bit where I said I didn't know how I felt about it, then proceeded to make up my mind. Lol. My only regret is not knowing about this sooner. Damn you life for getting in my way and taking up all my free time!
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Arron Syaoran

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #54 on: August 29, 2014, 14:36 »

I find the Slot+List system quite viable, as long as it doesn't have large numbers(or decimal numbers) like the ADOM Weight System. A pistol, for example, should be 1-8 slots, not 1750grams or stones or whatever. And Inventory space SHOULD have NO Impact on movement speed unless said inventory item is currently equipped. Volume-based inventory is always more preferred than weight-based in my opinion.

Reason for this: I Played ADOM, and found tonnes of weapons and armour I'd like to sell, but I always ended up overburdened, having to take multiple trips in and out of the dungeon just to sell stuff. Worst off, I could never run away from enemies because my inventory was usually full, and even worse, teleports are super rare in that game. I hate being forced to travel light just to have a combat advantage, especially with so many items that come from corpses(alot of them junk, such as rotten corpses or cursed items).
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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #55 on: August 30, 2014, 11:20 »

I was thinking of a slot/list hybrid since a few days too and I tried to make a quick mockup of the interface to see if it could work and found a few problems with this.

My idea was to have the bigger items take several lines in the inventory to have a direct idea of how much space they take instead of using numbers (Quicker reading of the information). The list helps keep things organised and easily sorted (we all once missed an item we had in a "tetris" inventory because of the added visual complexity of those). Now, the biggest problem I have with a list system is that you can't easily fit all the inventory on the screen while the grid system allows it. If we want to have an item preview in the inventory, the lines have to be quite big (16 lines at 60px each makes a 960px high list). So we either have to reduce the number of lines or only keep the name of the item.
If we reduce the number of lines, we can separate the items by categories (equipment, ammo, consumables) keep a bigger carrying capacity. and either have 3 lists on the sceen or use tabs (using tabs doesn't allow to see everyting but it doesn't bother me too much as the items would have separate categories). The example I'll give may seem ridiculous but think about the difference between the backpack in pokemon r/b and pokemon g/s, introducing different pouches for different items was a HUGE improvement. The category system also solves the ammo micromanagement situation. The problem some people may have with this is that depending on their playstyle, some may want to carry a lot of ammunition at the expense of consumables which is not possible with separate categories. Maybe starting with a relatively small space in those categories and having space upgrade items later in the game where you choose to improve one of the capacities would be interesting and keep the tactical decision of either carrying more ammo or one more medpack, even making the decision more important as it is definitive. The other things cool with this system is that it can be used for with challenge modes: limited ammo/consumables space, removing the space upgrades from the game.
While I'm not in favor of a text only list system, I doesn't mean we can't have an item preview at all. Because a list system doesn't take as much horizontal space as a grid we can use the free space to add an item description for the selected item with a preview, a bit of game lore about the item, space for the weapons/armor upgrade slots, full stats and a bunch of useful info without having to use a tooltip as in grid inventories. The category system can use the description too so I'm more favorable to the use of categories.

Oh, and an other thing:
Having separate boxes for separate ammo types makes perfect sense. If shotguns can have buckshot, slugs, and explosive rounds, you would need 3 boxes to carry the different types of ammo. It would be the cost of having options. Though if you really only wanted one box to store all three ammo types, that's extremely easy to do as well. You're already going to have max ammo counts with the boxes, so just split ammo to the max count. Example: Assuming you have a shotgun and an ammo box for a max of 45 shells. If you have 20 buckshot shell and nothing else, then the display would read 20/45 Shells and underneath it would read 20 B | 0 S | 0 E (B, S, and E obviously being replaced by graphics for Buckshot, Slugs, and Explosives respectively.) Pick up 10 slugs and it would read 30/45 Shells | 20 B | 10 S | 0 E. After picking up 5 explosive rounds it would read 35/45 Shells | 20 B | 10 S | 5 E. Simple to read, no extra ammo boxes, no messy UI, even when it comes to dropping certain ammo types. Click the box, click drop ammo, select the ammo type, done.
The initial idea behind the rework of the inventory system is to reduce the amount of micro-management, by allowing multiple ammo types in a same box, it would instead add a lot more micro-management: managing the number of ammo boxes you carry, the ammo box types you take and the types of ammo in them which IMHO will be irritating really fast.
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Arron Syaoran

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #56 on: August 30, 2014, 12:15 »

Why not have a multi-list system that has 2-4 columns, and when the first column is full, use up the next column. If there's only 1 space left on the first column, the next BFG(or large slot item) goes on the next column, but the next ring(or small slot item) finishes the first column.

It looks kinda like this:
Code: [Select]
##Inventory#########################################
#Pistol==========#................#................#
#2d4===6/6=======#................#................#
#----------------#................#................#
#BFG 9000--------#................#................#
#----------------#................#................#
#12d9--100/100---#................#................#
#Ammo Box(9mm)===#................#................#
#250/250=========#................#................#
#Small Ring------#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
#................#................#................#
###################################45/54 Slots Left#
"-" and "=" are to distinguish different items that take up multiple slots.
In this case: BFG9k takes up 4 slots, Pistol takes 2, Ammo Box takes 2 and Small Ring takes up only 1.
When the First column is full(or almost full if you just picked up a big item that doesn't fit), it goes on the second column.

Edit: The Name text would obviously be replaced by a graphic of the said gun/item. Detail/name text can be placed on the item icon, with details in highlighted tooltip. The reason why the items don't have graphics in the above example is because it's ASCII, and it's super hard to draw a gun using only 2-4 lines, especially if there's going to be item text.
« Last Edit: August 30, 2014, 12:18 by Arron Syaoran »
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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #57 on: August 30, 2014, 12:57 »

There is a problem with that solution, if you happen to have no one space item in your inventory you might have a situation where you have free spaces at the end of multiple columns and yet not be able to pick a big item as it can't fit anywhere even if you technically have enough space. We can still have a scrolling list (which might be inevitable on the lower resolutions) but it's terrible for a big inventory (think of the inventory in Skyrim). On Kornel's picture there is 96 spaces on the grid, if we go with a separate categories system, we could use 2/3 of this space for equipables. Assuming weapons and armors would take a minimum of 4 spaces (which I think is reasonable), you have a 96*2/3/4=16 capacity. So with this system there's not real need for multiple columns.
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Arron Syaoran

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #58 on: August 30, 2014, 14:04 »

Honestly, I'm perfectly fine with both a list system or a grid diablo 3 system. If it's going to be the latter, then make it so we can rotate items, and also make all items either square or rectangular in space(as in No L-shapes or T-shapes). And don't have a ton of sellable weapons/armour drop that clog up the inventory with only 2-10 items. If there is no selling to shop in this game, then lots of weapon/armour drops wouldn't be a problem for me with the diablo/RE4 system. There can still be a buy from shop case(you can buy, but not sell) like in zelda.

One of the things I hated about diablo 2(not diablo 3) is that it only took 5-10 weapons/armour to clog the inventory, and the weapons/armour themselves are worth at least some money, and have lower quality gear than typical starting/commonly worn gear.
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Kornel Kisielewicz

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Re: Design Rant : Inventory
« Reply #59 on: September 04, 2014, 16:24 »

Ok, problem here is, that it is very important for the tactical side of the game to have a situation where carrying less weapons/armor allows you to carry more ammo. This is one big tactical decision in DoomRL and without a good reason I'd like to keep it that way. Otherwise we could simply do ammo counts separate which would get rid of most problems.
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