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Author Topic: Doom : Repercussions of modding  (Read 21218 times)

SPTX

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Doom : Repercussions of modding
« on: September 15, 2014, 06:43 »

That was sleeping on my hard drive and since it's somewhat playable I thought it would be a waste to not make it available.

It basically lets you play as the demons. You start as either a lost soul or a former human then are given the option to change when you level up, after picking a trait.
Ultimately I want to replace the traits, but that will obviously have to wait for a future version of DoomRL.
CyberDemon and Mastermind are somewhat done but not enabled and archvile/painelemental spawn hostile monsters instead of friendly ones (then again, I'm hoping for a future version of DoomRL allowing friendlies).

EDIT: if you have a crash on launch download the fix here
EDITEDIT:
repacked with fix and fix of fix. Take the numbered archive.


EDIT : updated to 0.1.1, brief list of changes here, more details in changelog.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 09:00 by SPTX »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2014, 09:28 »

Cool! I've played an equivalent Doom mod once before. Needless to say, playing as arch viles was criminally fun, so yeah, I'm hoping the same thing about friendlies, lol.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2014, 04:08 »

Sounds really interesting, but when I gave it a try, it immediately crashed before I could even start!  :(  I copied the files into the modules folder and ran the "custom game" option.  Was there something different I was supposed to do?  I tried it three times, one for each class, (in case that made a difference) and it produced two error messages for each.  Here they are, in case it helps.

Code: [Select]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 16/09/2014 6:00:25
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnLoaded caught EAccessViolation!

Call path     : Repercussions.OnLoaded
Call params   : (false)
Error message : Access violation
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 16/09/2014 6:00:33
Error level : FATAL EXCEPTION
Message     : Fatal exception encountered

An unhandled exception occurred at $0046E619 :
ELuaException : LuaError: Repercussions.OnLoaded -- Access violation
  $0046E619  TDOOMLUA__ONERROR,  line 435 of src/doomlua.pas
  $00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pas
  $0041DFE6  TDOOM__CALLHOOK,  line 85 of src/doombase.pas
  $0041F2D3  TDOOM__RUN,  line 315 of src/doombase.pas
  $00401CC5  main,  line 111 of src/doomrl.pas

----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 16/09/2014 6:01:15
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnLoaded caught EAccessViolation!

Call path     : Repercussions.OnLoaded
Call params   : (false)
Error message : Access violation
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 16/09/2014 6:01:18
Error level : FATAL EXCEPTION
Message     : Fatal exception encountered

An unhandled exception occurred at $0046E619 :
ELuaException : LuaError: Repercussions.OnLoaded -- Access violation
  $0046E619  TDOOMLUA__ONERROR,  line 435 of src/doomlua.pas
  $00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pas
  $0041DFE6  TDOOM__CALLHOOK,  line 85 of src/doombase.pas
  $0041F2D3  TDOOM__RUN,  line 315 of src/doombase.pas
  $00401CC5  main,  line 111 of src/doomrl.pas

----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 16/09/2014 6:01:37
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnLoaded caught EAccessViolation!

Call path     : Repercussions.OnLoaded
Call params   : (false)
Error message : Access violation
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 16/09/2014 6:01:42
Error level : FATAL EXCEPTION
Message     : Fatal exception encountered

An unhandled exception occurred at $0046E619 :
ELuaException : LuaError: Repercussions.OnLoaded -- Access violation
  $0046E619  TDOOMLUA__ONERROR,  line 435 of src/doomlua.pas
  $00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pas
  $0041DFE6  TDOOM__CALLHOOK,  line 85 of src/doombase.pas
  $0041F2D3  TDOOM__RUN,  line 315 of src/doombase.pas
  $00401CC5  main,  line 111 of src/doomrl.pas

----------------------------------------------------------------------
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SPTX

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2014, 04:23 »

I'm curious about that line.
Code: [Select]
$00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pasIt points to an absolute path that obviously isn't your doomrl directory.
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Tormuse

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2014, 04:34 »

I'm curious about that line.
Code: [Select]
$00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pasIt points to an absolute path that obviously isn't your doomrl directory.

Hmm...  I don't have, nor have I ever had, anything in my E drive.  Is that something you programmed into it?  Like, do you have yours stored on E drive, so that's why it works fine for you but not for me?
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2014, 04:40 »

Hmm...  I don't have, nor have I ever had, anything in my E drive.  Is that something you programmed into it?
Nope. And neither do I. I'm afraid this issue is beyond my comprehension.

EDIT:
it's really weird, all I have OnLoaded is that
Code: [Select]
function Repercussions.OnLoaded()
local choice = ui.msg_choice("Do you want to become a Lost @<S@>oul or a Former @<H@>uman?","SH")
if choice == "S" then player.eq.weapon = "SPTXlostsoul"
elseif choice == "H" then player.eq.weapon = "SPTXformerhuman"
end
-- a bunch of comments
end
« Last Edit: September 16, 2014, 04:44 by SPTX »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2014, 06:06 »

No source access at the moment, but the crash is happening in the lua OnLoaded function, you're referencing something that doesn't exist (the other messages are just errors that happen due to the first one).

My wild guess would be that the player structure doesn't exist when calling OnLoaded, but it's a long time since I did any DoomRL modding.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #7 on: September 16, 2014, 06:56 »

My wild guess would be that the player structure doesn't exist when calling OnLoaded, but it's a long time since I did any DoomRL modding.
I'd harly believe that. I just tried on a fresh 0997 on an other OS than my usual and the issue wasn't reproduced. If that was so, it would happen systematically happen, right?
But would it be that anyway: Tormuse please, try to replace main.lua with this one.
« Last Edit: September 16, 2014, 06:59 by SPTX »
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Tormuse

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #8 on: September 16, 2014, 13:15 »

Okay, it works now.  :)  I have to go to work shortly, but I'll give it a good try when I get back.  :)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #9 on: September 16, 2014, 13:26 »

Then Kornel was certainly right. I'm at a loss, why does it "work for me"? Code is supposed to be executed in order.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #10 on: September 16, 2014, 19:00 »

Then Kornel was certainly right. I'm at a loss, why does it "work for me"? Code is supposed to be executed in order.

You're using code from Chaosforge.  I'm amazed that things are even running, given all the chaos injected into the code!  =D
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #11 on: September 16, 2014, 23:15 »

Okay, I gave the game a whirl, once as a Lost Soul, and once as a Former Human.  First impressions:  really cool mod!  :)  It's got some nice challenge to it, even at ITYTD, what with all your abilities nerfed like that.  (Thelaptop would approve)  ;)

A couple of questions:  At one point, my lost soul got promoted to imp and I was only able to throw a fireball once and it said I didn't have any ammo.  Is there some trick to reloading so I can fire again?  Does it use shells or something?

I conquered Hell's Arena as the former human, leveled up twice, and got promoted to Former Commando, but then when I passed the level, it prompted me if I wanted to become a Former Human or Lost Soul again and when I selected Former Human, I got bumped back down to pistol again.  (I didn't even get a chance to use the plasma rifle; hmph!)  Is that intended?

Do traits work?  I got a couple of levels of Brute in the Former Human game because I was thinking of getting a Vampyre build, but it still took like ten punches to even kill a lowly former human.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #12 on: September 17, 2014, 02:18 »

Okay, I gave the game a whirl, once as a Lost Soul, and once as a Former Human.  First impressions:  really cool mod!  :)  It's got some nice challenge to it, even at ITYTD, what with all your abilities nerfed like that.  (Thelaptop would approve)  ;)
I wanted to reproduce a 1:1 of the game's monsters the best I could. I thought playing as the weakest to the strongest would blend well with the linearity of the game's difficulty. Reality is, however, that first monsters are too weak and later too powerful, actually inverting the difficulty curve. It will be balanced in due time, well not due time, but for next version of doomRL for sure.

A couple of questions:  At one point, my lost soul got promoted to imp and I was only able to throw a fireball once and it said I didn't have any ammo.  Is there some trick to reloading so I can fire again?  Does it use shells or something?
Ah, I should have specified in the readme. It's temporary for this version, you get ammo when you kill. The amount depends on the character you play. Ultimately it will be made regenerated on tick and if/when possible directly within the 'magazine' rather than as ammo in the inventory. Right now there is no check on overflowing the inventory.

I conquered Hell's Arena as the former human, leveled up twice, and got promoted to Former Commando, but then when I passed the level, it prompted me if I wanted to become a Former Human or Lost Soul again and when I selected Former Human, I got bumped back down to pistol again.  (I didn't even get a chance to use the plasma rifle; hmph!)  Is that intended?
No that's a stupid mistake on my end. Two like inverted in the script that was supposed to fix the mod. This post contains a fix to the fix.

Do traits work?  I got a couple of levels of Brute in the Former Human game because I was thinking of getting a Vampyre build, but it still took like ten punches to even kill a lowly former human.
Some player values affected by traits are replaced when you change of demon.
These are :
-health
-maxhealth
-flags (particularly environment safety)
-move speed
-melee damage bonus
-armour
-chance to hit for melee

Regarding traits, they may or may not work, I haven't checked them and they are ultimately bound to get changed in the eventual future versions. Brute however should work, since the script handles melee damage as follows
Code: [Select]
player.todam = player:get_trait(traits["brute"]) * 3 - 1 (for former human)
« Last Edit: September 17, 2014, 03:09 by SPTX »
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Kornel Kisielewicz

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #13 on: September 17, 2014, 05:23 »

If you test it extensively, we'll throw it into the mod server.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #14 on: September 17, 2014, 16:31 »

I downloaded the new version and the leveling up works much better now, thank you.  :)

I haven't had a chance to thoroughly check traits yet, but Brute definitely doesn't work.  Brute 2 should give +6 damage, which means even if the base damage was zero, I should be able to kill Formers with two hits, not ten.  I tried another melee build game with the Lost Soul tree and even when I was at Demon level, I wasn't doing enough damage to activate the berserk effect of Berserker trait, unless I was already berserk from a berserk pack at the time.  (And speaking of the Demon, it needs a melee attack sound effect)  This is unfortunate for the game as it stands, since killing enemies is the only way to get ammo, which means you're quite heavily reliant on melee.  (Of course, I recognize that this isn't how the final version will be)

I can confirm that Vampyre trait and Intuition trait work, though.  :)

Also, are your "weapons" supposed to be moddable in the Lost Soul tree?  Somehow, it doesn't seem right that I can slap a tech mod on the Lost Soul's "bite" weapon.  (Though it is quite useful to do so)  :)

And on an related note, I like the descriptions you wrote in for your weapons and all the characters you can become.  :D
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Tormuse

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #15 on: September 17, 2014, 23:59 »

I just won a Former Human game at ITYTD.  :D  I was just kind of messing around, no build planned, really, but I thought you might like to see my mortem.  :)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)

Unfortunately, it crashed at the end, just before the mortem screen.  (Though thankfully, after generating the mortem, apparently)  Here's the error message:

Code: [Select]

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 18/09/2014 1:09:51
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnWinGame caught ELuaException!

Call path     : Repercussions.OnWinGame
Call params   : ()
Error message : Call(Repercussions.OnWinGame) not found!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 18/09/2014 1:10:04
Error level : FATAL EXCEPTION
Message     : Fatal exception encountered

An unhandled exception occurred at $0046E619 :
ELuaException : LuaError: Repercussions.OnWinGame -- Call(Repercussions.OnWinGame) not found!
  $0046E619  TDOOMLUA__ONERROR,  line 435 of src/doomlua.pas
  $00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pas
  $0041E492  TDOOM__CALLHOOKCHECK,  line 96 of src/doombase.pas
  $0041F83F  TDOOM__RUN,  line 416 of src/doombase.pas
  $00401CC5  main,  line 111 of src/doomrl.pas

----------------------------------------------------------------------


Also, I was playing a Lost Soul game earlier and got as far as Hell Knight level and I saved it to come back to it later but it said the saved game was corrupted and I couldn't continue.  :|  (That may or may not have been due to something I did; I have yet to recreate that bug)  EDIT:  Okay, it seems I can't save the game at all; the saved game gets corrupted/destroyed when I try to load it

And if you don't mind if I comment on play-balance a little, I must say that the Lost Soul tree is a lot more varied and interesting than the Former Human tree.  I think it would be good to add the Elite Formers to the list.  (Maybe you could become John Carmack as the top level?)  :)  As it is, you're stuck with the same Former Commando character from level 3 to the end of the game and since there are very few cells that early on, you're very reliant on melee.  Fortunately, for this game, I discovered that I could use the Chainsaw in the prepared slot if I got Juggler trait, so I was able to get by.  (Don't know if that's intended, but it was a big help)

EDIT:  Well, someone said that we should test it extensively, so...  ;)


(Note that on level 5, I was in Demon form and assembled a Piercing Bite!)  :D

This time, I did a normal win and it still crashed at the end.  Here's the error message:

Code: [Select]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 18/09/2014 4:44:03
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnWinGame caught ELuaException!

Call path     : Repercussions.OnWinGame
Call params   : ()
Error message : Call(Repercussions.OnWinGame) not found!
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 18/09/2014 4:44:05
Error level : FATAL EXCEPTION
Message     : Fatal exception encountered

An unhandled exception occurred at $0046E619 :
ELuaException : LuaError: Repercussions.OnWinGame -- Call(Repercussions.OnWinGame) not found!
  $0046E619  TDOOMLUA__ONERROR,  line 435 of src/doomlua.pas
  $00457F16  TLUASYSTEM__PROTECTEDCALL,  line 1476 of e:/Projects/fpcvalkyrie/src/vluasystem.pas
  $0041E492  TDOOM__CALLHOOKCHECK,  line 96 of src/doombase.pas
  $0041F83F  TDOOM__RUN,  line 416 of src/doombase.pas
  $00401CC5  main,  line 111 of src/doomrl.pas

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Using the Juggler trick to wield the Chainsaw still worked.  I'm guessing that's not as intended, although it's a rather fearsome image, a Revenant brandishing a chainsaw!  (Or a Knight or a Baron)  :)

A couple more bugs:  There's no sound when you attack as a Lost Soul.  (Should've mentioned that one earlier)  Also, when you're a Knight or Baron, you use "Cursed Power" to fire, but killing enemies doesn't replenish the Cursed Power like it does if you kill enemies while you're an imp.
« Last Edit: September 18, 2014, 02:56 by Tormuse »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #16 on: September 18, 2014, 05:48 »

Unfortunately, it crashed at the end, just before the mortem screen.  (Though thankfully, after generating the mortem, apparently)  Here's the error message:
Attached file should do the trick. Can you confirm?

Also, I was playing a Lost Soul game earlier and got as far as Hell Knight level and I saved it to come back to it later but it said the saved game was corrupted and I couldn't continue.  :|  (That may or may not have been due to something I did; I have yet to recreate that bug)  EDIT:  Okay, it seems I can't save the game at all; the saved game gets corrupted/destroyed when I try to load it
Unfortunately as it stands I have no way of understanding the issue. I'd have to know how saving intrinsically works within the engine. I thought it probably had to do with my renaming of the klasses but it seems not.

And if you don't mind if I comment on play-balance a little, I must say that the Lost Soul tree is a lot more varied and interesting than the Former Human tree.  I think it would be good to add the Elite Formers to the list.  (Maybe you could become John Carmack as the top level?)  :)  As it is, you're stuck with the same Former Commando character from level 3 to the end of the game and since there are very few cells that early on, you're very reliant on melee.
Well, sure, a bit more variety wouldn't hurt.

Using the Juggler trick to wield the Chainsaw still worked.  I'm guessing that's not as intended, although it's a rather fearsome image, a Revenant brandishing a chainsaw!  (Or a Knight or a Baron)  :)
Well, as I said the traits will be replaced in future versions when I'll be able to change them (which is, I was told, impossible as of now).

A couple more bugs:  There's no sound when you attack as a Lost Soul.  (Should've mentioned that one earlier)
Also, when you're a Knight or Baron, you use "Cursed Power" to fire, but killing enemies doesn't replenish the Cursed Power like it does if you kill enemies while you're an imp.
First point I know of, it's an issue with melee weapons, for some reason their sound doesn't play.
Now about the Baron and knight it's really weird, they are basically using the same code than the imp.
Code: [Select]
OnKill = function (being,player)
for n=1,2 do player.inv:add("SPTXcursedpower") end
player:power_backpack() end,
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Tormuse

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #17 on: September 18, 2014, 23:31 »

Attached file should do the trick. Can you confirm?

It did, thank you.  Here's the mortem for my latest game and it didn't crash this time:

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)

This time, I said "no" to all opportunities to change form and stayed as a Lost Soul the whole game.  I didn't realize that you get extra options if you do that!  That's pretty awesome!  :D  I'll have to check out the Former Human tree again and see if there are extra options there too!  :)  Also, I think I may have been mistaken earlier when I said that Brute never works; it seemed to work fine for the Lost Soul's bite attack.  I guess it only works if your primary weapon is melee?  I'll double check to see if it works for the Demon's bite attack too.

And on an unrelated note, I found a sniper mod and couldn't resist getting myself a sniper-bite!  :D  (I guess my bites are really accurate?)  :P

EDIT:  Also, the Lost Soul's ability to fly over acid and lava is pretty neat.  At some point, I'm gonna have to try a Nightmare! game to see if I can adapt my strategy around the Lost Soul's unique set of advantages and disadvantages.  (I haven't tried up 'til now because I was too daunted by having reduced hitpoints at higher difficulty settings)

EDIT2:  I tried again, playing as a Demon, this time with a Blademaster build.  (Bitemaster?)  ;)  It worked perfectly, giving me all the Brute bonuses and played like any melee game...  Then about halfway through, I switched to Arch-Vile to see what it was like and it changed over to the Arch-Vile's wimpy melee attack with no Brute bonus and not enough damage to make me go berserk.  And I still had the same problem that getting kills wouldn't restore my ammo, so I could only use the Hellfire attack once and then I was stuck with my wimpy, non-berserk melee attack for the rest of the game.  I was able to finish anyway, with a stair-dive and some lucky invulnerabilities, so here's the mortem:

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)

I also had a rather absurd problem that I kept spontaneously respawning my enemies!  I couldn't stop myself from doing it!  It wouldn't happen when no one was around, but any time I was facing an enemy and there was a corpse nearby, it would say "Tormuse raises his arms" and they would revive.  I had to do some creative corpse-stacking in some places.  :P
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 00:35 by Tormuse »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #18 on: September 19, 2014, 08:58 »

Okay, I have implemented regenerative ammo. It applies to demons using cursed power as ammo. They no longer gain ammo on kill, however said ammo wasn't removed and can still be gain via exp; 1 per 263 at the moment (arachnotron's exp value).
Their ammo will now regenerate at fixed rates depending of which demon you are playing, after shooting (it will still regenerate if you use melee attacks or get attacked).

I also modified a few things to work with this addition.
I have replaced the demon's attack speed values (was 1 turn everywhere) with their reload speed (which was based on the original monster's attack chance), attack is now slower for most of them.
Reloading for these demons is now almost instantaneous (0.1 turn) to give some incentive in using the now rarer cursed power.
Max ammo for these demons has also increased from 1 to something matching their power, where the more powerful the monster the less max ammo it has (imp has 8 fireballs, archevile has 1)
Non-former human monsters not using cursed power will have similar treatment in future versions, after the values are settled for the ones done in this version.

Any value, new and old, is obviously still subject for balance. I'd especially like to find a way to remove the health bonus I give on the two lowest difficulties.
I'll also somehow find some use for cursed power for monsters not using it as ammo. There is much room for ideas, it could be a small amount of berserk time for the pinky for example, health regen for the feeble former humans, etc. to be decided.

EDIT:
Forgot to mention that I disabled the archevile's resurrecting ability. As I am a very forgetful person, as much as I forgot to state I disabled the archevile's ability, I forgot to disable the painelemental's ability altogether.
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 09:07 by SPTX »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #19 on: September 19, 2014, 16:32 »

Okay, the following post and mortem is from a the previous version, since I haven't tried the new one yet.  I started a game last night and finished this morning, (I left it running overnight, since I know I can't save)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)

I was playing as a Sergeant to test what traits work and don't work for him.  The shotgun he carries gets the benefit from Shottyman and Shottyhead traits, but isn't actually a "shotgun" shotgun, in that I can't assemble it into an Elephant Gun.  I did this shortly after playing a game as a Former Human (which was *really* tedious with that accuracy zero pea-shooter he wields; a majority of his shots miss!)  His weapon isn't considered a pistol at all; it wasn't affected by Son of a Gun or Dualgunner and couldn't be modded into a Speedloader Pistol.  I also played briefly as a Former Captain and it's a *huge* step up from Former Human with his accuracy 4 Chaingun!  (A weapon which is normally accuracy 2)  It makes the difficulty curve pretty wonky when the level 2 character is so incredibly more advanced than the level 1 character.

I'll give the new version a try a little later.

EDIT:  Okay, I gave the new version a try.  :)  I played as an Imp for a while, then leveled up to a Knight and then a Baron.  (enemies that use the "cursed power" ammo)  I like the play balance of having the shots fire slower, but having multiple ammo in the "weapon."  I didn't actually use the speed reload of the cursed power much in this game, (except in big battles like the Cyberdemon and the Mastermind) but I expect that they would play a much larger role in higher difficulty levels.  (I'll try higher difficulties later on)  And now that I'm not completely reliant on melee, the melee attack has the right balance to make it a nice complement to my arsenal.  Don't know how I feel about my imp fireballs being able to blow up powerups.  :o  (Regular imp fireballs don't; bug or feature?)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)

EDIT2:  Just playing around and I discovered that the Mancubus Dual Rocket-Launcher doesn't count as a Rocket Launcher for Shottyman purposes.

EDIT3:  Just playing around some more and discovered that playing as a Pain Elemental with a Blademaster build is really quite ridiculous.  :)  Any time I get a kill, it takes zero time and the resulting production of Lost Souls also takes zero time, so I frequently had a situation where I would produce and kill 50 or more Lost Souls simultaneously!  :D  The best part was fighting the Cyberdemon, because killing him caused me to spawn a Lost Soul and the level didn't end because not all enemies were dead.  It almost ended in a stale mate there, because they were reproducing too rapidly, but a Shockwave pack was helpful in thinning out their numbers.  :)


Sorry, SPTX, I know this probably doesn't help you in terms of play-testing, but I thought it was too funny not to share.  :)
« Last Edit: September 19, 2014, 22:36 by Tormuse »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2014, 13:20 »

My best attempt at completing a Lost Soul only game at Ultraviolence.  Details of the game later...

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)

EDIT:  So, since the Lost Soul has 10hp, it's kind of like a high-speed, melee-only, flying Angel of Humanity game.  :)  (only without the benefit of extra equipment!)  :o  This makes for some necessarily interesting strategizing.  I had many attempts fail because I got too close to a Sergeant at the wrong moment and got instakilled, but most of the time, you can fly around so fast, that you can close distance by up to four squares and start biting them before they get a shot off.  It's extra important to face enemies one at a time, whenever possible, though, so it's helpful to use your high speed to maneuver into better positions before you start attacking.

Never underestimate the ability to fly, too.  Demons can be dispatched easily enough by flying over acid/lava rivers and then flying away as soon as the Demons step in.  Also, in this run, I flew over the lava in Chained Court to pick up the mod packs ahead of time, before facing anyone else.  :)

I made a lot of failed attempts at getting Vampyre trait in earlier runs where I didn't even get as far as Chained Court, so then I tried a Blademaster Build and seemed to fare better by mostly doing a stair dive.  When I got up to character levels 5 and 6, though, I decided that while Blademaster would be very useful, the immediate boost to attack speed from Finesse trait was needed much more than Hellrunner, which would have only given me a tiny boost to my already high movement speed.  It was tempting to get Finesse sooner because each attack took four times as long as moving about, but I needed the extra damage of Brute to be able to bring down Formers and Imps with one bite.

In the end, I got a little too overconfident; I entered level 6 Deimos, (I think?  The mortem doesn't say) and I was already berserk and next to an Arch-Vile/Mancubus pack and I thought I could take them out before they woke up, but no such luck.  If I had just headed straight to the exit, I'm sure I could have made it.  Oh well...
« Last Edit: September 25, 2014, 23:05 by Tormuse »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #21 on: June 25, 2015, 03:04 »

So, on a whim, I tried this mod again today, playing as a Lost Soul with a Blademaster build at Nightmare!  It was my best Lost Soul game yet and I was able to defeat the Cyberdemon!  :D  Unfortunately, the game froze up afterward and I couldn't continue.  :(  I think it had to do with the fact that I leveled up when I killed him.  I don't think the game dealt well with trying to prompt me to pick my new form at the same time it was trying to complete the level.  It showed the trait selection screen and when I tried to choose a trait, nothing happened.  It didn't crash, but it generated an error message a bunch of times, I guess once for each time I tried to select a trait.  They're all identical, so I'll just post one of them:

Code: [Select]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 25/06/2015 3:30:28
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,19)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

I don't know if anyone's updating this mod or even if anyone's looking at this forum at all, but I thought I'd share just in case.  :)
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SPTX

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #22 on: June 25, 2015, 04:22 »

Well I am here, but I have absolutely no idea of what this could actually mean. The day I know is the day I fix, hoping this day to also be the day doomrl would provide some support for modding traits (and also allowing large sprites on the player).
« Last Edit: July 15, 2015, 05:44 by SPTX »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #23 on: August 14, 2015, 03:46 »

Played again, same type of game, playing as a Lost Soul in Nightmare! going for Blademaster, and got the same problem, but this time, not from killing the Cyberdemon; it was after killing a random Baron somewhere on Deimos 3.  (Or somewhere around there, character level 6)  Same thing:  I selected a trait and nothing happened; it stayed on the trait selection screen and I could still move the cursor up and down with the arrow keys, but anything I selected didn't cause it to do anything.  After trying to select stuff a half dozen times, it froze, just like before.  Here's the error log, in case it helps someone track down the problem.

Code: [Select]
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:05
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,2)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:08
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,3)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:08
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,4)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:10
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,5)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:10
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,6)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:14
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,7)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:14
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,8)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:15
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,9)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Timestamp   : 14/08/2015 5:36:15
Error level : ERROR
Message     : Lua call OnPick caught ERangeError!

Call path     : traits.3.OnPick
Call params   : (<object>,10)
Error message : Range error
----------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #24 on: October 19, 2015, 21:37 »

Just felt like playing this mod again today and took it easy with an ITYTD Lost Soul game.  (Though, I still went for Conqueror for a bit of challenge)  :)  This time, I was fortunate enough that my experience level was just right so I didn't level up when killing the Cyberdemon and it allowed me to continue all the way to the end of the game!  :D  (It doesn't award medals, so you'll have to take my word for it that I got Conqueror)  :)  I also found a nuke and was able to get a full win.  How embarrassing for JC to be taken down by a Lost Soul!  :P

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #25 on: October 24, 2015, 00:19 »

WOO!  Lost Soul Conqueror at HNTR!  :D  This was pretty tough to do as it was a big step up from ITYTD.  :)

Hell's Arena was a huge hurdle to overcome and took many tries to do right.  The breakthrough was when I realized that I couldn't do it by brute force.  (Heh)  :)  I needed to use a little finesse (heh)  :)  and try to outspeed the Demons rather than fight them hand to hand...  er...  mouth to mouth?  (Wait, that sounds wrong)  :P  Bite to bite?  (Yeah, we'll go with that)  :)  I had a few attempts where I very nearly won in very long, tedious, drawn out battles where I had Finesse 2 and no Brute so each hit was doing 1 or 2 points of damage to the Demons and I had to very, *very* carefully time my hits so they couldn't hit me back.  (Lots of dancing around, counting moves before each hit 25 times for each one; very tedious)

But then, I played this game and I was lucky enough to find a tech mod in a vault in level 2 and that made everything a heck of a lot easier!  My tech-modded bite was faster than Finesse 2 and it freed me up to get Brute 1 which allowed me to complete Hell's Arena considerably more easily.  :)

After that, the rest of the game was pretty smooth sailing up until the Wall.  In my previous game, (posted above) I was fortunate to find a homing phase device, so I was able to phase on to one side of the Wall and then homing phase out at the end.  This time, I had to phase on to one side and then dance around the Barons until they blasted the wall behind me enough times to tunnel out.  I didn't have Dodgemaster, but the Lost Soul is pretty fast and was able to dodge most of the incoming fire, but I still took a lot of hits and was thankful for the large supply of medpacks I had built up.  Interestingly, my berserk lasted a surprisingly long time on that level from fighting the Knights and Barons.  Long enough to make me wonder, does this mod remove the cap on how long the berserk can last from berserker trait?

Anyway, I took a screenshot of it.  Unfortunately, it came out looking kind of weird; I think I forgot to adjust the ASCII display setting or something.  :S

Spoiler: Screenshot (click to show/hide)

I found an inordinate number of nukes and good thing too, since I realized that I can't equip the Nuclear BFG for nuking purposes.  :o

I expected the Mortuary to be a lot more difficult, but a well-placed Hatred Skull and Fire Skull from the City of Skulls prevented Arch-Viles from reviving too much, and I was zipping around so fast, I was able to take them out before they could do much anyway.

A couple things I noticed that may be bugs:

The game never generates Armor Shards except on levels that specifically generate them like Spider's Lair and Mortuary.  Bug or feature?

In the Armory, the right-most room had only one weapon instead of the usual four.  I'm sure the others weren't destroyed because there was nothing in there but a Demon and an Imp.  They just weren't generated.  The weapon that did generate was the Charch's Null Pointer.  (Unique)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #26 on: October 24, 2015, 02:49 »

There is no doc whatsoever about modifying traits and I remember someone telling me it wasn't a good idea too temper with them anyway, so no, no modified berserker.
I still want to mod the traits though... There are still a few things I'd like to do with this mod that I can't in the actual state of things. Namely, swaping the monster change to the traits, having the player character drawn with the property flag that's used for the cyberdemon/mastermind.

For the shards they are indeed set to 0. Here's the list of "denied" items. Of course nothing's definitive.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: October 24, 2015, 02:56 by SPTX »
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #27 on: July 13, 2017, 15:20 »

So, on a whim, I tried this mod out again.  (Has it really been two years since I last played it?)  O_o

I had the idea of playing a Vampyre build with the starting Lost Soul at N! difficulty for a while and this time, it actually worked!  :D  The whole thing was pretty much a stair-dive, with a bit of creative dancing around near the beginning, using the Lost Soul's speed to its fullest advantage.  As mentioned in my above posts in this thread, the Lost Soul makes for some unique strategizing, being very fast, but vulnerable (with 10HP) and able to fly over fluids to escape some dangerous situations.  At the start of CC, I flew over the lava to get the mod packs at the start, a bulk mod which I put on my bite (which was a big help) and a power mod which I eventually put on the red armour in Phobos Anomaly.  (Also a big help)

Even after CC, I still mostly stair-dived, (stair-dove?) killing only enemies that were on the way to the exit, trying not to get too greedy like in some of my previous runs.  A lucky phase got me past the ambush at Phobos Anomaly and a couple of invulnerability spheres in Deimos helped me level up to finally get Vampyre trait!  :D  Vampyre was a huge help (as it always is) especially because the super-fast Lost Soul can zip in and steal their HP before they can react, taking away Vampyre's biggest disadvantage.

I got a couple of levels in Finesse after that to ensure that my bite-rate was almost as fast as my move-speed and then I decided that a couple of extra max-HP might be useful, so I got Ironman and I discovered...  that it gives me 10 more HP, doubling my max HP!  :o  I fully expected it to give me 2HP like in AoHu and...  and...  why didn't I try that sooner?  O_o  *Facepalm*  Needless to say, doubling and then tripling my hitpoints made the rest of the game pretty easy.  :)

The only two special levels I completed were Spider's Lair, (which I only attempted because I was invulnerable and because my red armour was badly damaged and I wanted to repair it with the only two armour shards in the game besides Mortuary, which I wasn't going to attempt) and Unholy Cathedral.  (A must for any melee game)  :)  I came pretty close to clearing City of Skulls, but left early because I didn't want to lose my berserk power trying to hunt down the last few Lost Souls.  I couldn't do anything with all that weaponry I was carrying, but I thought they were worth carrying around as trophies for the mortem, showing what I'd done.  :D

The fire-protection from the red armour combined with the Lost Soul's natural fire protection meant that late-game enemies were easy to deal with, doing only 1 damage per hit, and due to my low max HP, triggering berserk every time they hit me!  I basically remained berserk for the rest of the game.  Come to think of it, I was in such good shape that I'm sure I could have taken on Mortuary and Lava Pits and probably JC with no problems, but after all my previous failed attempts, I just wanted a sure win, so I just charged the Mastermind and bit her to death.  :)  (She must've been very confused by this armour-wearing, super-powered, super-strong biting Lost Soul coming at her!)  :D

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #28 on: July 14, 2017, 01:04 »

You never cease to scare me :S

How did you get past the Bruisers (or Cybie for that matter) with so little HP and a relatively puny attack damage?
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #29 on: July 14, 2017, 15:28 »

How did you get past the Bruisers (or Cybie for that matter) with so little HP and a relatively puny attack damage?

I was already berserk when I entered Phobos Anomaly and the phase device took me behind them.  I zipped around the corner so I could take them one at a time.  After that success, I considered going after all the Nightmare creatures for extra experience, but I decided it was too risky and I wanted to keep the berserk going, so I went straight to the portal.

At this point, I had the power-modded red armour, so even if I hadn't teleported behind them, I'm sure I could have survived just charging them; with such low max HP, any hit from them would make me instantly berserk.  :)

And Cybie wasn't too much trouble; Lost Souls have natural fire resistance, and once I was berserk, he could only do one point of damage per hit.  My only concern was having my experience at a level that I wouldn't accidentally level up and crash the game when I kill him, like in the previous run.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #30 on: July 16, 2017, 00:32 »

Just beat this as a lost soul vampire build with 100% kills.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #31 on: July 17, 2017, 17:30 »

Just beat this as a lost soul vampire build with 100% kills.

Ha!  You didn't specify difficulty level, so I did it in ITYTD.  :D

It's a heck of a lot easier when there are fewer enemies to pick up med packs; I could zip around the levels, picking them all up before anyone knew what was happening.  :)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #32 on: September 11, 2017, 03:17 »

I wonder if this mod (in its current state, read: unfinished due to limitations) would warrant balance. Or should it stay as it is since most of its fun seems to reside in the large difference there is between each demon.
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #33 on: September 11, 2017, 11:16 »

Well, since it's your creation, there are no rules except the ones you make.  :)  But if you want to mess around with it, I'll be glad to test it for you.  :)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #34 on: July 20, 2018, 07:13 »

For no particular reason, I felt like playing this mod again today, again playing as a Lost Soul on N! with a Vampyre build.  This time, I took advantage of my discovery that Ironman trait consistently gives you 10 hp, effectively doubling the Lost Soul's starting hitpoints.  :D  So I had the Lost Soul's advantages of extra speed and natural flying without the disadvantage of reduced hit points.  It made things a heck of a lot easier and made me a lot bolder than my previous game, enough that I took on more of the special levels, including Halls of Carnage, the Mortuary, and Mt. Erebus.  I was also lucky enough to find a nuke, so I was able to nibble John Carmack to death for a full win.  Yay!  :D

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #35 on: September 24, 2019, 00:22 »

I felt like playing this mod recently, and decided to see if I could do it in Lost Soul form with a Blademaster build.  (Bitemaster?)  :P  This meant I had the opportunity to go ridiculously fast, with the Lost Soul's natural speed boost, Hellrunner, and agility-modded Tac boots, I was moving at 0.04 seconds per move while berserk, (0.03 if I took the armour off) and kills took zero time.  I kind of wonder...  how does that work, exactly?  I mean the idea behind Blademaster is that you swing the blade so fast that you chop multiple enemies with one swing, but how does that make sense if I'm biting them?  Am I biting everyone simultaneously?  :P  Oh well...

EDIT:  Also, I forgot to mention...  I encountered the same bug I encountered once before, where I leveled up and the game froze, making me unable to select a trait.  When this happened before, I had leveled up by killing the Cyberdemon, so I assumed that was the cause, but in this game, it was just some random level-up that triggered it.  The really curious thing is that when I realized that I seemingly couldn't advance any further in the game, I mashed some keys in frustration and...  somehow it broke out of being frozen!  :o  Not only that, but I got some extra traits out of it, bringing me up to Hellrunner 4 (even though that's supposed to be impossible) and Ironman 3.  I have no idea what I did that caused that, but it generated an error message, so I'll include it here:  (Looks like it generated three messages, one for each key mash)  :P

Spoiler: Error Message (click to show/hide)

Spoiler: Mortem (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 00:39 by Tormuse »
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Apostle Chaos Lt. General (0.9.9.7)
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SPTX

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #36 on: November 05, 2019, 03:23 »

I am afraid I can't fix that error without access to the source code.
The way I get it, that trait fetches modded sources as parametters, but the error doesn't report what is fetched. All I know is that it may be an enumerator going taken out of range, but there is no telling if it's even an enum I made nor how many items it's missing. If I could I'd make some error checking on the trait's function to limit itself to the enum's size (assuming an enum is the problem). Alternative is putting filler in my enum but then I'd have a few things to figure out (going totally blind) otherwise you'd get unexpected results.
Anyway, I'm glad you still play this mod.
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Tormuse

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Re: Doom : Repercussions of modding
« Reply #37 on: November 06, 2019, 23:21 »

I am afraid I can't fix that error without access to the source code.

Hmm?  The source code for DRL was released ages ago.  Here it is.  Or were you referring to something else?
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