DoomRL > Discussion

Long time, no see, DoomRL fans. Lots of questions :D

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bolt_thundara:
Lots of good information here and I'm putting it to good use. I'll definitely use this topic as a bit of an on-going playthru commentary as well, so stop on by from time to time to see what shenanigans I've gotten into xD

I keep the Assemblies page of the wiki pulled up in browser and I alt-tab alot, and I tend to post here if something truly unusual has happened. I'll keep doing that. Idk how many mortems I'll post unless something really weird happens OR I have a question about something in the mortem.

It's good to know that SoB applies AFTER range modifiers. That's actually pretty big. My last MAD run, I actually did invest heavy in SoB and TaN both. My natural inclination is to stand my ground to unload as much DpS as possible (if I'm not reloading with Shottyman), so TaN suits me right down to the ground.

Is 10 damage the breaking point for knockback? I'm honestly not sure how that mechanic works entirely. Like, I seem to knock back Formers quite a bit with a shotgun but they only have 10 HP so I'm missing something.

As for speedloaders... I carry an Ammo Chain for a reason. If I know a big fight is about to go down (or even if I am not expecting to need my shotgun), I'll simply equip that along with my HP pistol. Suddenly my reload problems are gone xD. I do the same thing with a shell box and tactical shotgun.

Tbh, I haven't really been having reload issues once I get HP and MSS. The knockback is so frequent I just reload until my current target moves back in range. Only time this didn't work recently was in Limbo, which is obviously a much different scenario.


... I always find myself struggling to have enough space and have trouble justifying keeping the Chainsaw. That's something I've actually been meaning to ask about. What should I realistically be holding on to? For instance, are consumables (other than large health kits) really worth taking up precious storage space? Like, I generally just pass phase packs on by. I'm usually carrying 3+ mods (too many I know, but I'm usually holding them for a Stormbolter or something once I hit WK1), a rocket launcher of some sort, a shotgun (unless it's prepared), an ammo chain (could be prepared), a shell box, a stack of rockets, a stack of shotgun shells, 3 stacks of 10 mm ammo, at least one enviro suit (prefer 2, just in case). The remaining slots are taken up with whatever oddities I've found. Stuff like 3+ pieces of armor (in various states of decay and/or exotics), as many med kits as I can justify room for, skulls if I have them (like to have them for Mortuary tbh), the BFG 9000 if I haven't been to Mortuary yet (at which point I dump it), a thermie, and occasionally the Arena Master's Staff. I always try to keep a thermie on me if I find one as well as getting the lava element.

Also, been toying with the idea of picking up a side-discipline in shotguns on my MSS runs. After I get MSS, grab one rank of WK and then two of Reload and Shottyman. My last run showed me how important having a backup weapon could be when the game completely quit giving me 10mm ammo. I was able to make it, and ranks in Finesse certainly helped, but having Shottyman would have meant me taking ALOT less damage. It was kind of a very specific unusual circumstance, though.

Anyway, questions for this round:

1) How exactly does knockback work?
2) HALP PLS with inventory management!?
3) Is it worth getting Shottyman on non-shotgun runs late game or is it better to focus on making the most out of your chosen discipline?

A bit off topic: Started watching Markiplier play the new Doom game. It looks so fucking awesome. If it goes on sale during Steam's summer sale, I might have to pick it up AND I DON'T EVEN LIKE FPS GAMES

ZicherCZ:
Well, to your questions:
1) The knockback threshold for one tile is 12 damage for pistols and rapid-fire and 7 damage for shotguns and most explosions (multiple-tile knockback is entirely possible). The calculation, whether a monster is knocked back, ignores its armor and resistances. Knockback resistance (from armor and boots) is then applied to the knockback distance.
3) If you carry a shotgun or rocket/missile launcher as a backup weapon, it is IMHO quite worthwhile. The prerequisite, Reloader 2 is useful for any build that can spare traits anyway, so you need only one more trait.

Evilpotatoe:
I keep the chainsaw not only because it saves some ammo or can make zerk pack more useful.
You'll often find yourself in melee, and chainsaw has a great DPS (which is even better after UC :). Killing monsters faster reduces damages.
Also, you sometimes want to stay melee (like vs mancubus or spiders). I don't use my usual shotgun in such a case (your HP pistol would have the same issue), and I don't carry ammo for my plasma gun, so the answer is melee again.

About SOB w/shotguns, I think I stopped using 7d3 shotguns when I noticed the HUGE difference it makes for knockback to have 2 less average damages. I always use a 8d3 now (reloading from one of my 3 shellboxes doesn't take more time than pumping anyway, and my doomguy is most of the time already OP by the time he could craft a tac shotty)
I was quite sure the damage was added after distance reductions, so I'm not surprised that it works so well.  I thought the treshold was 12dmg, but anyway, what counts is that some levels in SOB make the difference.  I don't care about the numbers too much.

About inventory, I always keep a phase device when I can.  Sometimes more, up to 3, but ammo will usually be more useful.  It can get you out of *really* nasty situations. (tip : When you don't have one, think of using rocket jump.  It's ideal for situations like... anomaly ambush whel playing AoHu).
You're right to dump the BFG.  I always keep it because... it's fun, thematic, and nice, but barely ever actually use it (even in the mortuary, where I rush to the nuclear one instead --sometimes using rocket jumps--).
I usually keep 2 skulls for mortuary, but rarely use the 2nd.
I only carry one suit for the pits/Erebus.  Taking some damages when running through some titles of acid / lava is not a problem.
I take thermies "because they are cool", but use them as fast as I can.  I nuke spidey the guaranteed way, with the nuke BFG from mort.  Alternatively, you can try to keep one for Cybie, or UC... but it's highly unreliable.  From a pure "efficiency" pov, I think there's no real reason to use them. You rarely need them, and the can make you miss stuff.
I always carry the staff (I'm a YAAM/conqueror/JC guy)
I avoid carrying unused mods.  I know what I need most of the times anyway, and rush WK to max mods usage and save slots.  Once my shotty is already P2 or P3, I put P on armors. A are for tac boots, then armors, B for Tac RL / (nanomachic or unused) plasma gun, then (unused) BFG, and T are for decoration.
I also thought I avoid carrying useless weapons but when thinking about it... I use mostly shotty / Chainsaw and RL, but always carry a plasma gun and a BFG, and sometimes keeps the missile launcher until HoC.
I usually have one extra armor (and sometimes up to 6/7 unused ones in the end, when I find some shielded vests, phaseshifts, Malek, Necro, Shielded... well, that's for decoration too, since I know I won't need them at that point)

I don't use shottyman.  It's useless when cornershotting, so I'd prefer going for DM, which will help me reach a safe spot. But aside of that subjective pov, I'd advise you to have "side-disciplines".  That's one of the reasons why I stopped using masteries, and nearly always pick BER : it makes me more versatile.

Tormuse:
Ah, the fact that it adds the SoB damage after calculating the range drop-off explains so much.  Good to know!  :)

bolt_thundara:
Note to self for tomorrow: Do not try to play this game while buzzed. Dying due to casually strolling through acid on an otherwise decent run is no ok.

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