DoomRL > Century Lounge
[U|Ao100|99%|YAVP] Centurial Platinum
iainuki:
Turns out the answer is 1 complex of cyberdemons per run, even though the Ao666 runs are quite a bit longer. Also worth noting, The Good Rogue's thread, https://forum.chaosforge.org/index.php/topic,7849.msg65862.html, also involved a full clear, though on HMP.
Tormuse:
I haven't really checked on this forum in a bit, but I see there's some interesting strategy discussion going on here! :)
--- Quote from: Sereg on April 06, 2020, 18:46 ---I've always been a fan of Ammochain builds - ammo management becomes a lot easier when you're only expending one round per burst, and that solves one of the biggest challenges of Ao100.
--- End quote ---
Personally, I've never been a fan of Ammochain, because of the lack of Eagle Eye. I'd rather have my weapons be more accurate, so I hit my targets more often and use less ammo that way. My preferred strategy for Ao100/ArchAo666 is to diversify my weapons, so I use a variety of ammo types, and then as much as possible, use whichever ammo there is the most of. (Though truth be told, for ArchAo666, I'd much rather do melee, because it's only kind of tedious, instead of incredibly tedious) :P
--- Quote from: ih8regin on April 06, 2020, 22:40 ---Note for the future - nightmare arachnotrons can shoot in melee range,
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I'd like to clarify that. Nightmare Arachnotrons have similar AI to Mancubi in that once they fire a barrage at you, they'll fire a second barrage shortly after, whether they can see you or not, even if you're in melee range. If you can get to melee range before they fire that first barrage, they'll be left with their weak melee attack.
Regardless, your best bet when facing them without a melee build is to seek cover and try to corner-shoot them one at a time, if possible. Unfortunately, cave levels don't always lend themselves to comfortable corner-shooting, and that's why Nightmare Arachnotron caves are one of the more dangerous levels in the game. Still, it's your best bet if you're going for YAAM.
--- Quote from: Sereg on April 06, 2020, 23:43 ---And now I'm tempted to try for a 100% Centurial Angelic run, just for "fun", but unfortunately my profile is on a computer that isn't easily accessible to me in the near future... nor have I ever really even come close to a N! 666 run. My Dervis' Medallion was a melee stairdive(Edit: and I apparently did it in under an hour, with a Minor Icarus Cross to boot) - to replicate even those first 100 levels going for 100% would be much more difficult, to say nothing of extremely tedious =P
Who knows, maybe Tormuse will eventually post such a mortem, though. He has a habit of doing insane things like that...
--- End quote ---
It's certainly possible... I think the biggest obstacle would be patience, quite frankly. I mean certainly the first bunch of levels will be extra tough, establishing yourself, and there's always the possibility of getting bad RNG, but once you get to a certain point, you have enough toughness and equipment to survive whatever the game throws at you, as long as you don't make any mistakes... which is a real occupational hazard for such a long, long, long game. Case in point right here. (Coincidentally, the only time I encountered a Cyberdemon Complex)
I think it's a little funny that you're talking about Cyberdemon Complexes in this thread as if they're an inevitability in DoomRL, when in all the thousands of games I've played, I've only encountered one once. :) They are an exceedingly rare level type. In any case, I think you're vastly underestimating the value of Dodgemaster. It significantly reduces the danger posed by Cyberdemons, as long as you use it properly. It's worth noting, (as someone here pointed out) that Cyberdemons can hurt each other, even if their own rockets don't hurt themselves. This makes it theoretically possible to thin out their numbers in a Cyberdemon Complex without firing a single shot, as evidenced by my victory at Trar's absurd "MockRL challenge.
iainuki:
--- Quote from: Tormuse on April 17, 2020, 21:48 ---Personally, I've never been a fan of Ammochain, because of the lack of Eagle Eye. I'd rather have my weapons be more accurate, so I hit my targets more often and use less ammo that way. My preferred strategy for Ao100/ArchAo666 is to diversify my weapons, so I use a variety of ammo types, and then as much as possible, use whichever ammo there is the most of. (Though truth be told, for ArchAo666, I'd much rather do melee, because it's only kind of tedious, instead of incredibly tedious) :P
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I'm glad to see my lack of enthusiasm about Ammochain validated by a better player than I :). I honestly think it's a fairly weak master trait. In Ao100/Ao666, as you note, its big problem is that it blocks Eagle Eye, which both saves ammo and increases your DPS because you hit more often. I think an even bigger problem is that it cuts off access to Intuition 2. It has other problems in other challenges and standard games.
--- Quote from: Tormuse on April 17, 2020, 21:48 ---I'd like to clarify that. Nightmare Arachnotrons have similar AI to Mancubi in that once they fire a barrage at you, they'll fire a second barrage shortly after, whether they can see you or not, even if you're in melee range. If you can get to melee range before they fire that first barrage, they'll be left with their weak melee attack.
--- End quote ---
Okay, I wasn't crazy then to remember hitting them in melee when I was in that arachnotron cave. That's useful to know at least.
--- Quote from: Tormuse on April 17, 2020, 21:48 ---Regardless, your best bet when facing them without a melee build is to seek cover and try to corner-shoot them one at a time, if possible. Unfortunately, cave levels don't always lend themselves to comfortable corner-shooting, and that's why Nightmare Arachnotron caves are one of the more dangerous levels in the game. Still, it's your best bet if you're going for YAAM.
--- End quote ---
I think finding a good way of dealing with nightmare arachnotron caverns is probably a prerequisite for this challenge. They're a lot more common than cyberdemon complexes, and I'd argue in many ways they're more dangerous too. Dodgemaster doesn't help much against them. Lucking into the Inquisitor's Set isn't necessary, but getting an energy-shielded vest might be a huge help. Alternately, some ridiculously high defense armor that nerfs their per-shot damage might also work.
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