Chaosforge Forum

DoomRL => Discussion => Topic started by: Tormuse on June 25, 2017, 00:28

Title: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on June 25, 2017, 00:28
Hi everyone!  I'm not sure where to put this thread, so if a moderator wants to move it, that's okay.  :)

Anyway, a while back, (about four years ago?) Maizure created a Beta version of a game based on DRL called Xtreme Arena.  Maizure invited me to try it out back then, but due to technical difficulties, it remained untouched on my hard drive until recently...  But now that I've tried it out, I must say that it's a pretty awesome creation that I can tell a lot of work went into, so I wanted to share some videos of me playing through it.  (And winning for the first time!)  :D  Here they are, about an hour each:

Part 1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FhOAw4FoCm4)

Part 2 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spkQs8ph8Bg)

Part 3 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-ptC_FZXD0)

It ended with a crash which I guess is par for the course when you're playing a Beta game, but I think it's still a pretty good showcase of a great DRL spin-off.  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: singalen on June 25, 2017, 01:22
Doom, Rogue-and-Superhot-like. Sounds fun!
Any plans to publish it?
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on June 25, 2017, 01:23
You killed KK! The game rightfully should crash because it ceases to exist immediately! (haha)

Nah you did so well that you unlocked the KK boss fight, which never got much play testing because no one has really done it (or at least didn't report the crash to me). Looks like a bug in KK's unique flame thrower weapon (pointer dereference after being freed). I'll see if I can dig up the sources and patch it. Then give it out here for all to play.

Thanks a lot for the video! I never expected a single play through to last 3 hours and after all that, it's a shame we don't get to see the victory stats.

Good times!

EDIT:
Doom, Rogue-and-Superhot-like. Sounds fun!
Any plans to publish it?

"Publish" is such a strong word for a product derived from another product that's received an official cease & desist noticed from the original creators :P
Nah the project is dead - abandonware
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on June 25, 2017, 03:26
You killed KK! The game rightfully should crash because it ceases to exist immediately! (haha)

Ah, so I was right; that *was* Kornel!  :D

Nah you did so well that you unlocked the KK boss fight, which never got much play testing because no one has really done it (or at least didn't report the crash to me). Looks like a bug in KK's unique flame thrower weapon (pointer dereference after being freed). I'll see if I can dig up the sources and patch it. Then give it out here for all to play.

Maybe I can try to win again, and this time just back away from KK when delivering the killing blow so that his flamethrower isn't active.  :)  (Of course, if you want to post a patched version here, that's welcome too)  ;)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on June 25, 2017, 03:38
Those plans would probably work...or avoiding conquerer..I think then you just get the Spidey fight and then the victory screen
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 19, 2017, 20:11
Well, I didn't hear from MaiZure, so I don't know if he ever ended up patching this, but I decided to try again to win and this time I carefully avoided killing KK while he had his flamethrower out and I got the proper victory screen.  :D  Here are some videos, which I labeled parts 4-6 just to distinguish them from my other three videos of this game:

Part 4 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l368wCBwwdE)

Part 5 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RmosTAuYMSk)

Part 6 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ffqQWs24LZQ)

There was an unfortunate crash of my recording software part-way through the second video.  At first, I thought the video was completely lost, but it did generate a video file...  It's just corrupted in a weird way that my copy of Microsoft Media Player doesn't recognize it, but other players seem to play it just fine.  I uploaded it all the same, so hopefully it's still viewable.  (I get an error message when I try to view it online, though, saying that my "browser doesn't recognize any of the video formats available")  I'm curious to know if anyone else is able to view it.  Does anyone else get errors when they click on "Part 5?"

EDIT:  Okay, actually, it seems that I get the same error for all three of the videos?  O_o  That's weird; I'm using the same software to record as always and all of my previously recorded videos are still viewable.  I'm not sure what the problem is; anyone else having any issues?
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 20, 2017, 21:47
Whoa that's an epic win there! I guess the game is too easy after all..hmmm...

I love the dig at thelaptop in the random newspaper article at the end. I forgot that feature was in there.

As for me, the videos seem to be playing just fine on this side. Might have been my terrible programming skill that crashes your camera app haha.

Thanks for taking the time to promote it!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: LuckyDee on August 21, 2017, 03:04
Whoa that's an epic win there! I guess the game is too easy after all..hmmm...

Can we pretty pretty please with sugar on top and a cherry not consider Tormuse's skill level as the new standard? Thank you.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 21, 2017, 05:57
Can we pretty pretty please with sugar on top and a cherry not consider Tormuse's skill level as the new standard? Thank you.

It seems like 100% of the people who play that game dominate the hell out of it. Too easy, I say!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: LuckyDee on August 21, 2017, 06:01
It seems like 100% of the people who play that game dominate the hell out of it. Too easy, I say!

Hey, I could really suck big time at this if I wanted to!

Valid point though.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: thelaptop on August 21, 2017, 07:10
I love the dig at thelaptop in the random newspaper article at the end. I forgot that feature was in there.

These days, I can't really nerf anything any more.  lol
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 21, 2017, 10:30
I guess the game is too easy after all..hmmm...

Maybe I'm making it look easy, but it took several dozen tries for me to get up to this skill level; it's still plenty challenging.  :)

Can we pretty pretty please with sugar on top and a cherry not consider Tormuse's skill level as the new standard? Thank you.

Hahaha, this is why difficulty settings exist.  Something to consider for future projects, perhaps, MaiZure?  :D

It seems like 100% of the people who play that game dominate the hell out of it. Too easy, I say!

Erm...  This seems to be a contradiction; didn't you say that I'm the only one to do this well?  Or are you saying that I am personally 100% of the people playing the game?  :)

As for me, the videos seem to be playing just fine on this side.

Yeah, me too!  It suddenly started working!  :o  Weird...  Computers are such mysterious things.

Might have been my terrible programming skill that crashes your camera app haha.

Aww, hey, don't be too hard on yourself; you made a very well-polished product that's quite enjoyable and with very few bugs in it.  It's something to be proud of.  :)

Thanks for taking the time to promote it!

No problem; it was fun!  :D  What do you think of posting a link so that other people can enjoy it too?  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: ZicherCZ on August 22, 2017, 01:33
It would be nice to give the game another shot after a few years - but for all the hell I can't find the post where DRL Xtreme Arena was available for download. Would anyone point to where I could download it?
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 22, 2017, 06:20
It would be nice to give the game another shot after a few years - but for all the hell I can't find the post where DRL Xtreme Arena was available for download. Would anyone point to where I could download it?

Seems to me that this might be the latest version:
http://www.maizure.org/DRL_XA-0.8.1.150.exe

Tormuse...can you verify that .150 is the most recent build? (Also, thanks for the kind words!)

While I'm at it, I may as well share the web-facing recent stats page:
http://www.maizure.org/drlxa/gamestats.php
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 22, 2017, 10:52
Tormuse...can you verify that .150 is the most recent build? (Also, thanks for the kind words!)


I'm not sure where it says the version, but the corner of the in-game menu screen says "Beta Build 132."  Am I reading your post correctly that we're up to version 150?  Am I 18 versions behind?  O_o
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 22, 2017, 16:21
I'm not sure where it says the version, but the corner of the in-game menu screen says "Beta Build 132."  Am I reading your post correctly that we're up to version 150?  Am I 18 versions behind?  O_o

Maybe that bug was fixed after all :P

Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 23, 2017, 10:30
Well, well, well, it seems there are three more special levels in this version!  (Military Base, Phobos Lab, and Deimos Lab)  Some graphical changes too.  (I might need to make another recording!)  :P

Also, I see from the stats page that I'm the first person to reach Field Marshal rank!  :D  And...  there's another rank above that?  :o  How do you reach that?  And I'm surprised to see that I'm the only one who got "Order of the Tomb;" does that mean no one has ever conquered The Mortuary before me?  Cool!  :D

There are lots of other medals I don't recognize:  Peace Pin, UAC Achievement Medal, Shadow Cross...  Sunrise Iron Fist?  Is that what I think it is?  (Did someone actually do this with fists only?)  O_o  I would hazard a guess that the Marksman Badge is for playing with only pistols; that might be a more achieveable goal as long as I get Dualgunner early on.  :)  Oh, wait, I just discovered that you get more information about players if you hover over the names in the Career Average section and it seems I already have the Marksman Badge?  Do you get it for just getting a certain number of pistol kills or something?  Is there a list somewhere of what each badge is for?  Or would you rather keep that a secret?

In any case, now that this is posted publicly, it would be pretty cool to see some more names on the list, especially the Domination and Cyberdemon Complex lists:

http://www.maizure.org/drlxa/domscores.php

http://www.maizure.org/drlxa/complexscores.php

(Other game modes that I didn't include in my video)  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on August 23, 2017, 17:16
 Is there a stable, relatively bug-free version available? I mightbe interested...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 23, 2017, 17:48
The one that MaiZure just posted seems to work well.  Here it is again:

http://www.maizure.org/DRL_XA-0.8.1.150.exe

EDIT:  I notice that four other people have played so far since it was posted.  Awesome!  :D
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 23, 2017, 20:11
Overall, I never had many reports of crashes during gameplay....it either worked on your system right away, or it didnt work at all.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 24, 2017, 00:37
Yeah, honestly, the thing with Kornel's flamethrower was the only crash I had while playing.  Just try not to completely dominate everything and you'll be fine.  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on August 24, 2017, 08:24
Just try not to completely dominate everything and you'll be fine.  :)

I should experience no issues whatsoever,  then...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on August 29, 2017, 08:22
Huh, this is kinda fun. I wish I knew what my medals were though - is there a way to get more information from the mortem screen?(Edit: So there is... hover the mouse.)

One thing I noticed... on the game statistics page, VANDAM has a higher career average then Tormuse(o_O)... he only played 6 games, to be sure, but... perhaps this lends some legitimacy to his claims relating to normal DRL?
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 29, 2017, 12:34
One thing I noticed... on the game statistics page, VANDAM has a higher career average then Tormuse(o_O)... he only played 6 games, to be sure, but... perhaps this lends some legitimacy to his claims relating to normal DRL?

Perhaps...  It's hard to say because that list contains all games across all versions of the game and I'm finding there's a sizeable leap in difficulty between versions.  (For example, I'm finding the shotgun to be *a lot* less reliable in this version; it seems to be affected by my accuracy rating and I can't count on it to hit my enemies even if they're right in front of me!)  :|  Also, I think it's worth noting that 3000 points isn't terribly hard to get, (your last game came pretty close!) and my "career average" includes all my short-lived attempts at a melee build.

I am sure that Vandam is an excellent player.  However, I am also still fairly sure that Vandam's accomplishments are exaggerated.

EDIT:  And thus motivated by spite, I decided to try to raise my average to see if I can get above Vandam's.  :D  One of my better games, I got number 3 on the high scores list!  :D

Some interesting things:  In this version, the order of the special levels seems to be randomized; I got Gotcha! as the third special level, Spider's Lair as the fourth, and Hell's Armory as the fifth.  Interestingly, it seems that even though I skipped facing the Cyberdemon and Spider Mastermind the normal way, it counted them as defeated (with overlapping text on the mortem screen) because I got them in Gotcha!  This somehow caused me to be facing Kornel after level 5!  O_o  I was not prepared to face him and was barely able to lightly wound him before he finished me off.

EDIT2:  That's odd...  It's not displaying my latest game on the stats page!  Is there a delay before it shows up or something?  :|
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: scotherns on August 30, 2017, 02:25
Is there any way to change the resolution? The bottom of the screen is cut off on my laptop (not so much that it makes it unplayable, just a bit annoying).
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 30, 2017, 15:32
Is there any way to change the resolution? The bottom of the screen is cut off on my laptop (not so much that it makes it unplayable, just a bit annoying).

I don't believe so.

EDIT2:  That's odd...  It's not displaying my latest game on the stats page!  Is there a delay before it shows up or something?  :|

There may have been an issue with the Internet xonnection to my score server at that moment. I remember some issue when thst happened long ago.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 30, 2017, 21:20
Is there any way to change the resolution? The bottom of the screen is cut off on my laptop (not so much that it makes it unplayable, just a bit annoying).

Can you change the native resolution of your laptop?

EDIT:  And on an unrelated note, awww, I just discovered that Gun Kata doesn't work with the Blaster!  And neither does Dualgunner!  :(  Bug or feature?  (Either way, I'm disappointed; that would've been an epic game!)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on August 30, 2017, 22:23
From my limited experimentation with DG, it looks like each level works with very specific weapons, so blaster probably doesn't make the list until a very high level, if at all.

Speaking of dual gunner, I'm liking the twists on the DRL traits. Really cool game you've got here, Maizure. Well done.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 30, 2017, 22:46
From my limited experimentation with DG, it looks like each level works with very specific weapons, so blaster probably doesn't make the list until a very high level, if at all.

I have an old stash of source code (b115) in front of me and it looks like:

DG1 is pistols
DG2 is shotguns and chainguns
DG3 is everything else? even rockets? damn

Sadly, I've lost me design document to time so I don't know everything that was tweaked

Speaking of dual gunner, I'm liking the twists on the DRL traits. Really cool game you've got here, Maizure. Well done.

Thanks for the kind words! I've had a ton of positive feedback on the game overall. Glad people had fun with it!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 31, 2017, 03:21
There may have been an issue with the Internet xonnection to my score server at that moment. I remember some issue when thst happened long ago.

It's still happening; it didn't record my game from earlier today either.  :|  Is there a way to check the status of the internet connection of your score server?  Also, alternate theory:  Maybe it isn't recording the results of games where I die to bosses?  (Or some other issue with this latest version of the game?)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 31, 2017, 04:08
It's still happening; it didn't record my game from earlier today either.  :|  Is there a way to check the status of the internet connection of your score server?  Also, alternate theory:  Maybe it isn't recording the results of games where I die to bosses?  (Or some other issue with this latest version of the game?)

The server only saw on connection from you over the last 12 hours -- the game you scored 5973. I didn't see any other game attempts.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 31, 2017, 12:33
Oh, hey!  There they are!  My display on the stats page suddenly went from saying "62 runs" to "65 runs"  I guess there really is a delay before they get put up there!  My 3rd place 17099 point game is up there now!  :D
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 31, 2017, 13:59
Oh, hey!  There they are!  My display on the stats page suddenly went from saying "62 runs" to "65 runs"  I guess there really is a delay before they get put up there!  My 3rd place 17099 point game is up there now!  :D

Ah thats good! Just FYI, on my server you have to forcefully refresh the page every time you visit. It was meant as a debug tool for mywelf so I didnt make it user friendly.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 31, 2017, 18:53
If you guy's would like, I could reset all the game stats on the server...there was a 1 year gap between games
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 31, 2017, 20:06
*Shrug*  I don't know...  It sort of feels like erasing a little piece of history, but then again, I don't know if there's anyone left who cares about those records, so I guess I'm largely indifferent?  (Though I still kind of want to see if I can beat Vandam's average)  :D
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on August 31, 2017, 20:08
Ah! I'll leave it be then.

Up until I stopped development in July 2013, I had been cleaning them regularly for each version. Good luck
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on August 31, 2017, 23:08
Up until I stopped development in July 2013, I had been cleaning them regularly for each version. Good luck

In that case, I probably contaminated the high score list by playing all those games with the previous version.  (Oops!)  :P

...on my server you have to forcefully refresh the page every time you visit...

Ah, okay, that explains it, then.  And yes, refreshing the page fixes it.

In other news, I just played another winning game!  :D  Once again, I faced Kornel after round 5 of the Arena, so I didn't have enough time to get a super high score, but it was high enough to get number 2!  :)  Once again, I drew Gotcha! which made me kill the Cyberdemon and Spider Mastermind early; I have a feeling that if I am able to put off killing those two, I can make the game last longer and get an even higher score.  Funnily enough, I got credit for Mastermind's Brain, even though Cybie was the one doing the killing.  :)

On a completely unrelated note, I've been meaning to ask...  I notice that when I get a berserk pack, the red screen effect seems to be based on real time, rather than in-game time.  (ie if I hold still, the red screen will end even though no in-game time has passed)  Do you lose all the berserk bonuses when the screen returns to normal too?  Does this mean it's more efficient to charge ahead while you're berserk to get the most benefit?

EDIT:  Also, I'm pretty close to beating Vandam's average score!  :D
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 01, 2017, 00:33
Pretty damn good run right there....

In other news, I just played another winning game!  :D  Once again, I faced Kornel after round 5 of the Arena, so I didn't have enough time to get a super high score, but it was high enough to get number 2!  :)  Once again, I drew Gotcha! which made me kill the Cyberdemon and Spider Mastermind early; I have a feeling that if I am able to put off killing those two, I can make the game last longer and get an even higher score.  Funnily enough, I got credit for Mastermind's Brain, even though Cybie was the one doing the killing.  :)

I'm pretty sure the ability to win early was intended...but probably not tested much.

On a completely unrelated note, I've been meaning to ask...  I notice that when I get a berserk pack, the red screen effect seems to be based on real time, rather than in-game time.  (ie if I hold still, the red screen will end even though no in-game time has passed)  Do you lose all the berserk bonuses when the screen returns to normal too?  Does this mean it's more efficient to charge ahead while you're berserk to get the most benefit?

EDIT:  Also, I'm pretty close to beating Vandam's average score!  :D

Yes, berserk is real-time because this is Xtreme! Arena! Intended
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 01, 2017, 09:46
I have a question. How in the *HELL* are you supposed to do the Anomaly in XA? I just went in there invulnerable and still got smoked without getting a single kill...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 01, 2017, 16:45
I have a question. How in the *HELL* are you supposed to do the Anomaly in XA? I just went in there invulnerable and still got smoked without getting a single kill...

Tormuse will have to give out advice on that, but I'm pretty sure that Anomaly was covered in one or more of his gameplay videos... I personally haven't played in forever.

That said, XA by design goes really hard on players who try to be 100% completionists in terms of difficulty scaling. The game can be beaten pretty easily for casual players who duck out of the arena early and skip the special level challenges, etc. I think even the bosses like KK scale their health based on how many rounds of the arena the players have completed, etc.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 01, 2017, 19:56
Phobos Anomaly is freakin' tough.  I die there a lot too.  The only cover is a room that's so tiny that any shot that flies in there splashes and tosses you around, and those Demons are damn troublesome, especially when multiple of them gang up on you.

My advice?...  Try to eliminate as many of the Demons as you can first, if possible, using the Chaingun or Chainsaw (if you have Finesse and/or Brute) or Plasma Rifle. (if you're lucky enough to find one)  Nothing messes me up like trying to bear down on one of the Bruisers and having a Demon flank me.  Stay in the starting room if enemies threaten to overwhelm you, but don't get stuck in there because there's no room in there to avoid splash, so if you see an opportunity to move out where there's more space to maneuver, do so.  Try to isolate enemies to take them out one at a time and retreat to the start if too many start coming at you at once.

That's pretty much what I do; most of the time, I'm just flying by the seat of my pants on that level.  It's really easy for things to go wrong.  And yeah, you can see me pull it off twice in parts 1 and 4 of my videos; just click the link where it says "Phobos Anomaly" to jump to that part of the video.  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 01, 2017, 21:20
Thanks, that helps... I might go back to my old DRL policy of avoiding special levels like the plague, then, lol.

I have a new question, now. MaiZure, why would you build secret tunnels into the walls of the Chained Court, and then lure me in with a "Something Extremely Valuable" or whatever message? I am now long lost to where no pathway goes...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 01, 2017, 22:20
Thanks, that helps... I might go back to my old DRL policy of avoiding special levels like the plague, then, lol.

I have a new question, now. MaiZure, why would you build secret tunnels into the walls of the Chained Court, and then lure me in with a "Something Extremely Valuable" or whatever message? I am now long lost to where no pathway goes...

Wish I could remember exactly, but I do recall that there is a network of hidden tunnels but you're never stuck. I think the tunnels just twist and turn a lot, but there are some fixed goodies in the network at the bottom left. I don't think unique items drop in the tunnel though. One I know that unique items can be destroyed without you know about it.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 02, 2017, 01:13
Watch out, MaiZure, Sereg just beat your career average!  :D

Wish I could remember exactly, but I do recall that there is a network of hidden tunnels but you're never stuck. I think the tunnels just twist and turn a lot, but there are some fixed goodies in the network at the bottom left. I don't think unique items drop in the tunnel though. One I know that unique items can be destroyed without you know about it.

Wait...  what?  There's a secret passage?  O_o  I thought the "something valuable" message was referring to the supercharge/megasphere/armour in the doorway!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 02, 2017, 01:35
Watch out, MaiZure, Sereg just beat your career average!  :D

Wait...  what?  There's a secret passage?  O_o  I thought the "something valuable" message was referring to the supercharge/megasphere/armour in the doorway!

It probably is...I haven't seen this level in years :)

I was thinking that if a unique is generated, I doubt it would be in the passage.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 02, 2017, 05:08
So I tried loading up a game of DRL:XA...and these default controls are terrible hahaha. I can't even figure out how to play my own game coherently. Hmmmm...BUG
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 02, 2017, 12:44
Yeah, the controls are a little weird, but I've gotten used to them.  :)  The ability to redefine the keys would be a nice feature for future projects!  :D

EDIT:  As for the secret passage in CC, I found I was able to navigate it by running the Chainsaw as I walk around.  (It makes sparks fly, which makes it easy to figure out where I am and what direction I'm facing)  I didn't find anything, though, and there doesn't seem to be any point in going in there.  (Unless I'm missing something?)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 02, 2017, 17:23
Yeah, the controls are a little weird, but I've gotten used to them.  :)  The ability to redefine the keys would be a nice feature for future projects!  :D

You can go to the 3rd or 4th help screen (the one about the controls) and from there you can change controls by clicking the one you want to change and then clicking the one you want to replace it with. I was having more serious issues...the strafe key always being engaged for instance. Not intended.

EDIT:  As for the secret passage in CC, I found I was able to navigate it by running the Chainsaw as I walk around.  (It makes sparks fly, which makes it easy to figure out where I am and what direction I'm facing)  I didn't find anything, though, and there doesn't seem to be any point in going in there.  (Unless I'm missing something?)

I'm pretty sure there's something worthwhile down those tunnels. One thing that is worthwhile for newbies is that enemies don't go down the tunnel unless they're in trouble. So you can safely hide in there.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 02, 2017, 17:56
Tried the chainsaw method and it works for navigating... still couldn't find anything cool though.

Speaking of chainsaws, dualwielding them appears to be broken - they don't do any damage or even have any animation. Dualgunner 3 is still badass though.

I have also found keys mysteriously engaged, or at least enemies moving freely while I'm not doing anything, but it's a rare occurence and I'm not sure what exactly causes it.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 02, 2017, 23:23
You can go to the 3rd or 4th help screen (the one about the controls) and from there you can change controls by clicking the one you want to change and then clicking the one you want to replace it with.

Ah, I see it.  It's the 2nd help screen.

I was having more serious issues...the strafe key always being engaged for instance. Not intended.

Never encountered that.  :|

I have also found keys mysteriously engaged, or at least enemies moving freely while I'm not doing anything, but it's a rare occurence and I'm not sure what exactly causes it.

I've only had this happen once.  (During Cyberdemon Complex; yikes!)  I don't know what I did to cause it, but it happened right at the beginning of the level.

In other news, I beat Vandam's career average!  :D  EDIT:  Today's lesson is that pettiness is a great motivator. (http://thepigeongazette.tumblr.com/post/163718522753/without-spite-my-heart-may-actually-stop)  :P
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 03, 2017, 00:46
In other news, I beat Vandam's career average!

Awesome job...that's a pretty amazing game average.

Have you played around with the other game modes? Domination and the Complex?
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 03, 2017, 01:59
I have...  but it just occurred to me that I haven't tried them in the new version!  :o  I'd better get on that.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 03, 2017, 08:50
I've played with them a bit,  but I'm more interested in the main game mode just now... still, it's awesome that they're available and apparently fully functional.

And Tormuse,  whether you believe in the legend of VANDAM  or not, it's still a damn impressive average - hell,  only a handful of my games are even close to that, much less above it - so congratulations.

Would be nice to see more of the DRL community join us in playing XA... It's damn near as much fun as the original,  and it's a great way to pass the time and keep our skills up while we wait for Jupiter Hell.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: scotherns on September 04, 2017, 01:10
It really is a fantastic game, loving it so far.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 04, 2017, 02:34
Have you played around with the other game modes? Domination and the Complex?

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the difficulty of the Cyberdemon Complex has been ramped up significantly in this version.  I just played a game where, by the time I had killed 9 of them, Mark 5 Cybies were coming at me.  (Two at once!)  O_o  In the previous version, I once played a game where I killed 23 Cyberdemons and the Mark 5's were just starting to appear by then.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 02:39
It really is a fantastic game, loving it so far.

Thanks! This was a project back from the summer of 2013. Good times!

Yeah, I'm pretty sure the difficulty of the Cyberdemon Complex has been ramped up significantly in this version.  I just played a game where, by the time I had killed 9 of them, Mark 5 Cybies were coming at me.  (Two at once!)  O_o  In the previous version, I once played a game where I killed 23 Cyberdemons and the Mark 5's were just starting to appear by then.

Yeah during play testing way back in the day, I discovered that you could easily settle in to a lull where you'd dominate and the ending stats become meaningless because you could kill dozens of Cybies. I wanted every single kill to be meaningful. Not sure much testing happened at this difficult, except for VANDAM haha. He was something crazy.

Edit: Here is the scores for the complex:
http://www.maizure.org/drlxa/complexscores.php

Hey while we're at it...domination mode:
http://www.maizure.org/drlxa/domscores.php
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 14:56
First win... can't remember how to post an image directly, so the build is attached for whatever that's worth. EEx2, SoBx2, Finx2, and a lucky SS to finish it off. The strategy was to burn KK down as quickly as possible, since in the past I've never managed to survive long enough to kill him(playing without stored medkits is a new thing to me =P). Fortunately, I got the exact build I was looking for, even playing more conservatively as I progressed through the arena battles(in the past I've tried to push too hard and nasty things spawn and smoke me), and the strategy was a success.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 04, 2017, 16:37
Woo!  Congrats!  :D  And yeah, it's like a permanent Angel of Impatience; it takes some getting used to.  Looks like you pulled it off, though, and considering that this is the more difficult newer version, that's a pretty good achievement!  :)

*Awkward segué*

And I just re-achieved my record of 23 Cyberdemons in the Cyberdemon Complex!  :D  (Somehow, I didn't beat Longdong's score, though; not sure what they did differently; oh well)  I kind of wish I'd recorded it, because there were some pretty epic, harrowing battles which I would not have survived if not for Ironman 5 and TaN 2!  (And a lucky find of a megasphere that I picked up a split second before the conveyor belt dumped it in the lava)  There were a few times where I got stunlocked and rockets were throwing me around like a rag doll and I was amazed I survived, but eventually, I just got hit by one barrage too many.  :P  EDIT:  Ah, now that I look again, the Entrenchment was also probably a huge contributer to my survival.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 16:41
Nicely done... I barely got my one kill o.O

In other news, I've discovered the secret of the iron fist:
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 16:47
Whoa,

Congratz Sereg on the first win...and learning a new secret. There's still two possible medals that no one has managed to earn yet...

And congratz Tormuse for taking down that many Cybies in the complex. Yeah that place was meant for the past-paced brutal action. I originally wanted to tie the domination modes and the complex together at some point, but I didn't have any good ideas for balance. Good stuff!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 17:53
To be fair, VANDAM also holds the Sunrise Iron Fist, but that was a very long time ago. Still, his player stats showed he never won, so I figured it was worth a try just playing fists only melee for awhile - and to be fair, as strong as Brute is, and as useful as Finesse is for melee, it's actually not too difficult(though it's certainly more of a challenge then using weapons).

As far as the un-earned medals, the Peace Pin sounds like it's reliant on making monsters kill each other, rather then doing it yourself, but how to actually make that happen is beyond me. The UAC Achievement Medal is fairly low in the hierarchy, so I can't imagine it's all that difficult to acquire, but I don't really have a clue where to begin on that one.

Edit: VANDAM is also the sole holder of the Shadow Cross... my only guess would be that it has something to do with the invisibility powerups? At least with Sunrise Iron Fist I had the DRL version of the medal as a guide.

Edit2: LongDong appears to be the sole holder of the Survivor Ribbon. My only guess on that is it's something like Explorer/Conqueror.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 18:15
To be fair, VANDAM also holds the Sunrise Iron Fist, but that was a very long time ago. Still, his player stats showed he never won, so I figured it was worth a try just playing fists only melee for awhile - and to be fair, as strong as Brute is, and as useful as Finesse is for melee, it's actually not too difficult(though it's certainly more of a challenge then using weapons).


VANDAM won a lot on previous version of the game. When it hit 0.8, the stats were wiped and he only played very few games on this version. He was highly practiced coming in to this.

As far as the un-earned medals, the Peace Pin sounds like it's reliant on making monsters kill each other, rather then doing it yourself, but how to actually make that happen is beyond me. The UAC Achievement Medal is fairly low in the hierarchy, so I can't imagine it's all that difficult to acquire, but I don't really have a clue where to begin on that one.

Peace pin - yep monster civil war is one method. Barrels...lava pits...

Edit: VANDAM is also the sole holder of the Shadow Cross... my only guess would be that it has something to do with the invisibility powerups? At least with Sunrise Iron Fist I had the DRL version of the medal as a guide.

I don't remember this at all :P

Edit2: LongDong appears to be the sole holder of the Survivor Ribbon. My only guess on that is it's something like Explorer/Conqueror.

I think the survivor ribbon is more luck based...like finishing the level (or leaving the level) with like 2% health or something like that.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 04, 2017, 19:31
In other news, I've discovered the secret of the iron fist:

25 kills?  Is that all?  :o  With a few well placed berserk packs, that shouldn't be too difficult.  Similarly, I notice that the Marksman badge is for 25 pistol kills, so with Dualgunner, that's not too difficult either.

Peace pin - yep monster civil war is one method. Barrels...lava pits...

Is this another "25 kill" thing?  That might be doable too; a well timed invulnerability would be a big help.

I don't remember this at all :P

Oh, great, we may never find out the secret, then.  :P

I think the survivor ribbon is more luck based...like finishing the level (or leaving the level) with like 2% health or something like that.

Oh, is that all?  Just step in the lava a bit before getting the last enemy in CC; should be easy enough...  No, wait, you drain the lava before facing the Barons/Knights...  well, just leave a single Former Human to ping you a bunch of times before you finish him off.  That should do it.  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 19:44
Oh, great, we may never find out the secret, then.  :P

Ok ok, I just looked in the code...
If you finish any round without taking any damage, you get the sun medal.
If you finish round 3 without taking any damage, you get the shadow cross.
I believe that's cumulative damage, so you have to clear ALL the rounds without taking damage.

Oh, is that all?  Just step in the lava a bit before getting the last enemy in CC; should be easy enough...  No, wait, you drain the lava before facing the Barons/Knights...  well, just leave a single Former Human to ping you a bunch of times before you finish him off.  That should do it.  :)

That might work....it's a price best paid in the early in the game if you want a full medal count.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 20:05
All three rounds without damage? The legend of VANDAM continues... I suppose it should be manageable in the first arena battle, but I'll leave that to Tormuse =P

Thanks for the code-diving, MaiZure... I suppose one of us ought to start adding some of this stuff to the wiki. Any of the editors play XA?

As far as the 25 kills, berserk isn't really necessary... one level of Brute means you kill just about anything in the early rounds of each battle in two hits, to say nothing of two or three levels. It's also not too challenging to get into melee range... hiding around corners, followed by a calculated roll, can usually get you the jump on most enemies, and that's usually enough to kill them with minimal damage. It's actually significantly easier then DRL to go fists only here.

KK is still probably almost impossible to kill this way, though...


Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 20:34
I suppose one of us ought to start adding some of this stuff to the wiki. Any of the editors play XA?

I don't think XA ever made it in to the wiki since it wasn't publicly available until last week!

KK is still probably almost impossible to kill this way, though...

I should throw out there that KK's difficult varies wildly based on player performance...in fact in his weakest state, I don't think he even has all his weapons and toys available. As Tormuse mentioned, it's possible to face KK as early as round 5. But big points go to finishing him at the end.

The most important component to his difficult involves the number of rounds you've completed overall. I think it may bump more if you've totally dominated any rounds (no hits/damage to yourself). Naturally these things affect your final score too. So if you've managed to play perfectly, then expect a very dangerous final fight with the chance to lose it all :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 21:40
That explains my last run... had a laser rifle and the backpack and a lot of nice traits and still couldn't take KK down.

You might want to check that your traits are working as intended... I have Army of the Dead x2 and the final trait effect list(pictured) shows the effect for Fireangel(which I did not take), not Army. Might have finished that boss fight if my backup chaingun actually was armor piercing...

Oh well, still my best run to date.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 21:54
You might want to check that your traits are working as intended... I have Army of the Dead x2 and the final trait effect list(pictured) shows the effect for Fireangel(which I did not take), not Army. Might have finished that boss fight if my backup chaingun actually was armor piercing...

Bug in the end game display -- missing break in a switch statement.
It should read: "Shotguns pierce armor with max damage". MADx2 is kind of line sharpshooter for shotguns

Still pretty impressive though!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 21:58
Oh, hmm, in the in game help menu it states that AotDx1 is armor penetration for shells, x2 for bullets, x3 for plasma, which is why I grabbed the second level - I haven't actually found much use for shotguns in XA, but I sure do like my chaingun.

Which is the case, scaling weapon types as with dualgunner, or scaling penetration per your most recent post?
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 22:06
Oh, hmm, in the in game help menu it states that AoDx1 is armor penetration for shells, x2 for bullets, x3 for plasma, which is why I grabbed the second level - I haven't actually found much use for shotguns in XA.

Quick look at the code confirms what I said...

                if (army_of_the_dead > 1)
                    pellet.damage = 3
                else
                    pellet.damage += rnd_range(1,3)

However...it also affects the MINIGUN. Miniguns ignore armor if army of the dead is higher than 1. Damn?

So far, that's all I see.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 22:11
Hmm, then it's the help file that's in need of a correction - assuming you're still actively developing XA(and I really hope you are, at least to some extent - it's a hell of alot of fun, despite the occasional bug or other minor issue).

I have yet to find the minigun, but that will be something to keep in mind... am I to understand that it fires shotgun pellets instead of bullets? Does it draw from the shotgun ammo pool, then? Seems like it wouldn't keep firing for very long, if so...

Edit: Or perhaps I'm misreading, and AotDx2 boosts minigun damage specifically, not bullet damage in general? I was just going by the code fragment you posted, but maybe there's more.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 22:20
Hmm, then it's the help file that's in need of a correction - assuming you're still actively developing XA(and I really hope you are, at least to some extent - it's a hell of alot of fun, despite the occasional bug or other minor issue).

August 24th, 2013 was the last code commit and I haven't touched it since. I took 3 months off work that summer and traveled in Europe while putting this together in my spare time. I started work again on Sept 1st that year back home here in Japan. Is the project dead hmmm...yeah :P. I could probably update it, but bigger issue that I have some rough house rules where I work. Anything I make while employed belongs to the company, etc. I highly doubt they'd press it for a computer game, but you never know.

I have yet to find the minigun, but that will be something to keep in mind... am I to understand that it fires shotgun pellets instead of bullets? Does it draw from the shotgun ammo pool, then? Seems like it wouldn't keep firing for very long, if so...

Bullet weapons are treated differently than shotgun, yes.

You fire one shotgun shell and each shell generates a number of pellets, each with its own scatter (random speed and direction). So if you fire the Jackhammer, it'll fire multiple shells in a blast and generate that many more times the number of pellets.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 04, 2017, 22:28
Ah, shame about the company rules... well, I will enjoy it as is, for now. Thanks for actively engaging on this thread, and being willing to code-dive and explain the discrepancies for us ;)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 04, 2017, 22:36
Thanks for actively engaging on this thread, and being willing to code-dive and explain the discrepancies for us ;)

Thanks for playing the game! And code reading is one of my past-times, but usually not my own haha.

I could probably dust it off and get it building again for some updates. Honestly, I was running out of things to add and the bug list isn't very long. I'd be glad to entertain ideas for a proper release at some point
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 05, 2017, 00:10
Ok ok, I just looked in the code...
If you finish any round without taking any damage, you get the sun medal.
If you finish round 3 without taking any damage, you get the shadow cross.
I believe that's cumulative damage, so you have to clear ALL the rounds without taking damage.

Oh, really?  Hmm...  I know I'm not the best at avoiding damage, but I would've thought I had done that at least once out of all those games I played.  (At least the Sun Medal)  Wait a minute...  *Looks up recording*  What about the UAC Gold Star medal that says "valiantly eliminated an entire enemy platoon without a scratch" or Order of the Wind, which says "demonstrated mastery at avoiding incoming damage."  I got both of those in my winning game that I posted...  (part 6)  although, come to think of it, that was in the previous version, so maybe it awarded medals differently?  :|

I have yet to find the minigun, but that will be something to keep in mind... am I to understand that it fires shotgun pellets instead of bullets? Does it draw from the shotgun ammo pool, then? Seems like it wouldn't keep firing for very long, if so...

It's a super chaingun; it takes a few seconds to spin up and then it sprays bullets ridiculously fast.  (You can see me use it a few times in my videos)  :)  Having that as an armour-piercing weapon would be...  impressive.  :o

Ah, shame about the company rules... well, I will enjoy it as is, for now. Thanks for actively engaging on this thread, and being willing to code-dive and explain the discrepancies for us ;)

And I'd like to echo what Sereg said here; thanks for participating in this thread!  :)  And yeah, it sucks that your company rules control you like that, though I think it's worth noting that, as you said earlier, this game is based on a game that received a cease and desist order...  so your company probably won't want to touch it.  ;)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 05, 2017, 02:25
Oh, really?  Hmm...  I know I'm not the best at avoiding damage, but I would've thought I had done that at least once out of all those games I played.  (At least the Sun Medal)  Wait a minute...  *Looks up recording*  What about the UAC Gold Star medal that says "valiantly eliminated an entire enemy platoon without a scratch" or Order of the Wind, which says "demonstrated mastery at avoiding incoming damage."  I got both of those in my winning game that I posted...  (part 6)  although, come to think of it, that was in the previous version, so maybe it awarded medals differently?  :|

UAC Gold - 25 kills without damage -- contributes 2 points to final rank determination
UAC Silver - 10 kills without damage -- contributes 2 points to final rank determination
UAC Bronze - 5 kills without damage -- contributes 1 points to final rank determination
Shadow Cross - Complete 3 rounds without damage - contributes 5 points to final rank determination

Every 3 rank points you earn contributes to your final rank based on....ah hell here's the code routine (Build 150):


switch (total_rank_points / 3)   /* Note: truncated integer */
{
    case 0: return "Private"; break;
    case 1: return "Private First Class"; break;
    case 2: return "Lance Corporal"; break;
    case 3: return "Corporal"; break;
    case 4: return "Sergeant"; break;
    case 5: return "Staff Sergeant"; break;
    case 6: return "Gunnery Sergeant"; break;
    case 7: return "Master Sergeant"; break;
    case 8: return "First Sergeant"; break;
    case 9: return "Sergeant Major"; break;
    case 10: return "Command Sergeant Major"; break;
    case 11: return "Warrant Officer"; break;
    case 12: return "Chief Warrant Officer"; break;
    case 13: return "2nd Lt."; break;
    case 14: return "1st Lt."; break;
    case 15: return "Captain"; break;
    case 16: return "Major"; break;
    case 17: return "Major"; break;
    case 18: return "Lt. Colonel"; break;
    case 19: return "Lt. Colonel"; break;
    case 20: return "Colonel"; break;
    case 21: return "Colonel"; break;
    case 22: return "Br. General"; break;
    case 23: return "Br. General"; break;
    case 24: return "Major General"; break;
    case 25: return "Major General"; break;
    case 26: return "Lt. General"; break;
    case 27: return "Lt. General"; break;
    case 28: return "General"; break;
    case 29: return "General"; break;
    case 30: return "Field Marshal"; break;
    case 31: return "Field Marshal"; break;
    default: return "Chaoslord"; break;
}

And I'd like to echo what Sereg said here; thanks for participating in this thread!  :)  And yeah, it sucks that your company rules control you like that, though I think it's worth noting that, as you said earlier, this game is based on a game that received a cease and desist order...  so your company probably won't want to touch it.  ;)

Very true! Ever moreso is that there's no money here, so no money lost to them (nothing to recover in court).
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 05, 2017, 05:08
Ah so rank is based on badges, not score... that explains a few things I wondered about...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: ZicherCZ on September 05, 2017, 05:23
Just my luck.

Cybie killed. Spidey killed. Chained Court and Military base cleared. First three arenas cleared. All of that with a 100% killrate. Four monsters left in the last wave of the fourth arena, all tucked in the other half of the map. Me with 100% health and 136% armor. And then wham ... power outage.

Ah well. Maybe next time ...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 05, 2017, 05:39
Ah so rank is based on badges, not score... that explains a few things I wondered about...

Beat KK as a private - I dare you!
Ok, beating KK awards you the Seal of the Forge which is 12 points...enough for Sergeant rank

EDIT: And yeah, shinies might get you more rank, but it's the score that puts you at the top of the list ;)

Just my luck.

Cybie killed. Spidey killed. Chained Court and Military base cleared. First three arenas cleared. All of that with a 100% killrate. Four monsters left in the last wave of the fourth arena, all tucked in the other half of the map. Me with 100% health and 136% armor. And then wham ... power outage.

Ah well. Maybe next time ...

Pretty sure that possibility is part of the XA RNG :P
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 05, 2017, 06:23
 Damn Zicher, that's a hell of a game... and a hell of a way to lose it =X

Hmm,  Seal is just from beating the Epyon? Are you sure there aren't more conditions?  My victory game didn't earn me the seal,  and I just checked your stats page... it shows one victory (which was against KK, not mastermind or something)  but doesn't display Seal in my list of earned badges...
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 05, 2017, 06:28
Hmm,  Seal is just from beating the Epyon? Are you sure there aren't more conditions?  My victory game didn't earn me the seal,  and I just checked your stats page... it shows one victory (which was against KK, not mastermind or something)  but doesn't display Seal in my list of earned badges...

Oh hmm it's a bit more difficult than that:

switch (Game.cybie_dead + Game.spidey_dead + Game.kk_dead)
{
    case 1: Game.anvil = true;      rank_score+=3;  break;
    case 2: Game.hammer = true; rank_score+=6;  break;
    case 3: Game.seal = true;       rank_score+=12; break;
}

You get the seal for killing Epyon, but ONLY IF you've killed everyone else too... Kind of reinforces that 100% completion reward thing. You always get a reward from killing a major boss though...so if you've only killed Epyon, you still get the Anvil. But you can only get 1 of these "of the Forge" rewards per game

EDIT: I suppose that means you can win and only earn one promotion then hahaha.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 05, 2017, 06:36
I must have skipped Gotcha! that time...

Oh well,  good to know for next time.  Thanks.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 05, 2017, 10:13
Just my luck.

Cybie killed. Spidey killed. Chained Court and Military base cleared. First three arenas cleared. All of that with a 100% killrate. Four monsters left in the last wave of the fourth arena, all tucked in the other half of the map. Me with 100% health and 136% armor. And then wham ... power outage.

Ah well. Maybe next time ...

Oh no!  :o  Aw, crap, that sounds awful!  :|  I've had similar situations, so I feel your pain.  :|

UAC Gold - 25 kills without damage -- contributes 2 points to final rank determination
UAC Silver - 10 kills without damage -- contributes 2 points to final rank determination
UAC Bronze - 5 kills without damage -- contributes 1 points to final rank determination
Shadow Cross - Complete 3 rounds without damage - contributes 5 points to final rank determination

So, if I'm understanding this right, you earn the UAC Stars based on total Aced enemies throughout the whole run, whereas for the Sun and Shadow medals, you need a lot of consecutive kills?

(Still don't know what Order of the Wind is for)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 05, 2017, 11:25
Most Order of Foo medals are for special levels,  but that one is listed separately, and I would think you off all people would have gotten all of those by now anyway... maybe MaiZure can help us out there.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 05, 2017, 17:39
So, if I'm understanding this right, you earn the UAC Stars based on total Aced enemies throughout the whole run, whereas for the Sun and Shadow medals, you need a lot of consecutive kills?

(Still don't know what Order of the Wind is for)

Sun medal is for finishing an arena round without taking damage...doesn't matter how many guys there in there. (don't think it works for special levels though)

Shadow cross is for an entire level of the arena, all 3 rounds/waves

Order of the Wind is for 50 successful dodges in a game. Now that's a bit tricky. Basically whenever a projectile is created, it gets tagged if it's definitely going to hit you if you don't move. (so it's not true for bullets, fireballs, or pellets that are slightly off target to begin with). Well if that shot ends up not hiting you by the time it disappears, it gets counted as a dodge. Somehow you avoided a shot that was going to hit you if you didn't do anything.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 05, 2017, 21:07
I got Survivor Ribbon!  :D

I did it in Chained Court.  I took Brute as my starting trait and used the berserk pack to run through the lava and kill the two Knights.  (That way, I didn't have to drain the lava)  Then, I killed all the formers, being careful to leave one injured Former Human as the last enemy.  Then, I very *very* carefully stepped into the lava over and over again until I was down to 2% health, then finished off the last guy.  I don't know if I needed to still be at 2% when I left the level, but I didn't want to take any chances, so I passed up a Supercharge on my way out.  (Which was a contributing factor to me not surviving the first round of the Arena)  :P

Unfortunately, all the attempts I made at this lowered my career average below Vandam again!  :o  (This included attempts where I carried out the above strategy right up until the end and then stayed in the lava a little too long or got shot by the last guy; *facepalm*)  I'll have to see if I can bring that up again.  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 05, 2017, 21:12
Congratz...maybe?
Sometimes you gotta ask yourself if it's really worth it...

One thing is for sure, any time someone earns a survivor ribbon, there's probably a story behind it. Maybe it should only apply to the KK fight? Nah, I like it where it is.

Go get VANDAM!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 05, 2017, 21:15
Congratz...maybe?
Sometimes you gotta ask yourself if it's really worth it...

Just for the story is worth it, I think.  :D

Also, one thing I meant to comment on earlier...

I could probably dust it off and get it building again for some updates. Honestly, I was running out of things to add and the bug list isn't very long. I'd be glad to entertain ideas for a proper release at some point

The "Onslaught" and "Conquest of Hell" challenges are still listed ingame as "upcoming game modes."  Sounds like you did have some ideas for additions.  Just sayin'  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 05, 2017, 21:21
Just for the story is worth it, I think.  :D

Also, one thing I meant to comment on earlier...

The "Onslaught" and "Conquest of Hell" challenges are still listed ingame as an "upcoming game modes."  Sounds like you did have some ideas for additions.  Just sayin'  :)

The conquest of hell was meant to be a special level gauntlet - no arena, just one special after the next. Unlocks after you've actually finished each level on domination. Not really a fully developed idea, but I toyed with branching between levels, etc. Never got beyond the mental exercise.

Onslaught was supposed to be just one never-ending arena level, round after round and see how far you get. The gimmick here was that only formerly successful marines in the arena could enter this mode. In the main game room, I had the idea that you could "Store" up to 5 past surviving heroes as statues on the side somewhere. Walk up to it and become him to enter the mode?

Just the ideas...

EDIT: The idea that you could revisit past heros had a lot of appeal. But you couldn't 'grow' them any more than their original arena run.

EDIT2: I probably shouldn't mention that I had a local network Versus arena working with a buddy :P.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 08, 2017, 19:56
Sun medal is for finishing an arena round without taking damage...doesn't matter how many guys there in there.

That can't be right, then.  I just played a couple games where I completed Arena rounds without damage and I still haven't achieved it.  I see that some other people achieved it, so I assume it's possible, but there must be some other condition.

Onslaught was supposed to be just one never-ending arena level, round after round and see how far you get. The gimmick here was that only formerly successful marines in the arena could enter this mode. In the main game room, I had the idea that you could "Store" up to 5 past surviving heroes as statues on the side somewhere. Walk up to it and become him to enter the mode?

It's too bad it never got finished, then, because that sounds like a really cool idea!  :)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Sereg on September 08, 2017, 21:48
O_o I seem to get the Sun Medal fairly consistently - I'm almost shocked you haven't managed it yet. In my experience, and according to my AAR newspaper, the conditions he stated are exactly what is required.

Unless there's some bug(if playerName != "Tormuse"), I'm not sure what the problem might be...

I also like the idea of the additional game modes... I certainly hope you get around to finishing XA someday, MaiZure.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 08, 2017, 22:47
Unless there's some bug(if playerName != "Tormuse"), I'm not sure what the problem might be...

That would be a feature :P

I also like the idea of the additional game modes... I certainly hope you get around to finishing XA someday, MaiZure.

I may just do that. It was a fun project, and those extra modes did sound good on paper.

Thanks for playing and giving feedback!
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 09, 2017, 00:20
I just had a thought...  Could it be counting the health decay from being above 100% health as "damage?"  I think in both of those above-mentioned games of mine, I had a supercharge.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 09, 2017, 01:55
I just had a thought...  Could it be counting the health decay from being above 100% health as "damage?"  I think in both of those above-mentioned games of mine, I had a supercharge.

I think you might be right...I recall that was an issue, but I'm not sure if I handled it
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 09, 2017, 21:52
If only there was a badge for killing all but one enemies without damage and then taking a point of damage from the last guy on the level.  I'd have about fifty of those!  :P
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 10, 2017, 20:06
(My above post is exaggerating, but not by much)  :P

Seriously, though, I think there's something funny going on with the Sun Medal or maybe I'm still misunderstanding the requirements, because I just played a game where I successfully cleared two rounds of the Arena without damage, (Aced every enemy and this time, no supercharge!  No health bonuses either; just stayed at 100% health the whole time) and I didn't get the medal.  I don't know what I'm doing wrong.  :|

In other news, I encountered Phobos Lab for the first time and, while I know it's a bit late for bug reports, it looks like it lacked playtesting, because the enemies have a lot of difficulty navigating the narrow corridors and avoiding stepping in lava.  (Seriously, the first half of the level was constant monster pain sounds until a whole bunch of them died in the lava)

And just so this post isn't all negative, I just lucked into getting Vampyre and Blademaster in the same game!  It was as awesome as it sounds.  :D
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 10, 2017, 20:35
Seriously, though, I think there's something funny going on with the Sun Medal or maybe I'm still misunderstanding the requirements, because I just played a game where I successfully cleared two rounds of the Arena without damage, (Aced every enemy and this time, no supercharge!  No health bonuses either; just stayed at 100% health the whole time) and I didn't get the medal.  I don't know what I'm doing wrong.  :|

In other news, I encountered Phobos Lab for the first time and, while I know it's a bit late for bug reports, it looks like it lacked playtesting, because the enemies have a lot of difficulty navigating the narrow corridors and avoiding stepping in lava.  (Seriously, the first half of the level was constant monster pain sounds until a whole bunch of them died in the lava)

Where were you 4 years ago???

I recall those issues with Phobos lab...I remember I would just start the level and wait about 30 seconds for things to normalize. I think I didn't fix it because I actually thought it would be close to impossible otherwise...I remember that being a damn hard level despite the bugs
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 17, 2017, 00:50
I just played a mostly successful game...  as in I got to Kornel, but then died...  :P  I must say this version of the game is considerably harder than the one I played in my videos!  :|

Anyway, I seem to have misunderstood how the boss system works.  It seems that you face KK every time you complete level 5.  I thought that if you haven't killed the Cyberdemon or Spider Mastermind by the time you complete Arena level 5, you could keep the game going longer.  Like you would face Cybie after level 5, then the MM after some later level, and then finally KK after some other later level.  Alternatively, I thought, at the very least, you needed to have Conqueror for KK to appear.  This run disproves both of these; after level 5, I had no choice but move on to the boss stage and face KK.

The special level before level 3 was Gotcha! (the level with Cybie and MM) and I deliberately skipped it, running right past both of them, so I wouldn't get credit for killing them, thinking that this would help the game go on longer and get me a higher score.  (It shows in the picture below that that's the one level I didn't complete)

I guess this means that my top score is truly unbeatable!  :D  (Since I got it in the previous version with more levels; oops!)

EDIT:  Oh yeah, what if I actually include those screenshots?  :P
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 17, 2017, 03:06
I know I was thinking towards the end of development that the game was too long to truly be Xtreme, but I didn't recall that I had permanently cut it down to 5 rounds. Although, shorter and tougher sounds good to me! Should I wipe all scores before version 150?

Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 17, 2017, 03:14
Should I wipe all scores before version 150?

*Shrug*  I'm indifferent.  I don't know what anyone else thinks.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 17, 2017, 03:28
Done!

Your career average just went through the roof :P
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 17, 2017, 03:53
Wow...  That is a big difference!  :o

Does this mean the higher ranks are impossible now?  (Is there some secret to getting Chaoslord rank?)
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 17, 2017, 04:02
All the code I quoted about ranks a few pages back was from this version...and ranks aren't tied to score at all although they are highly correlated.

My guess is that it IS possible, but it would require planning and knowledge of all possible ways to gain rank points

EDIT: For instance, had you killed KK and gotten that terrible terrible survivor ribbon, you'd be 3 ranks higher, which would have been the highest so far in this version. Also, did you get the Cybie Head or Spidey brain? Those are both worth an extra rank in terms of medal score. Shadow Cross is 1 point shy of 2 ranks. Those could have put you all to Chaoslord
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: Tormuse on September 17, 2017, 04:09
Hmm...  Sounds like my biggest barrier to advancing ranks is my inability to avoid damage, then.  :P  I'll have to work on that.
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: MaiZure on September 17, 2017, 04:15
Yeah there's really two score systems in play here, one of them based on getting through the game (Score) and the other based on fringe heroics/achievements (Rank/Medals). It makes for some oddball possibilities like...A huge score with low rank, or vice-versa. But like I said, a lot of it is guesswork without knowing the system. The game wasn't popular enough to get people really trying to break it down like that

EDIT: It's actually not too different than DoomRL, except no one ever looks at the "score" part of the mortem...only medals :P
Title: Re: DRL: Xtreme Arena
Post by: thelaptop on September 17, 2017, 05:15
*Shrug*  I'm indifferent.  I don't know what anyone else thinks.
Yes, wipe 'em all!  There's new interest now, so a fresh slate on a "standard" version may be the right way forward.