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DoomRL => Discussion => Topic started by: Cheesybox on December 06, 2011, 16:45

Title: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Cheesybox on December 06, 2011, 16:45
I know it's not something given out and whatever but I'd really like a hint as how to wield this thing. I've had number of games drop it, and my past 2 games in row dropped it as well and (I feel like) I've tried everything.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I don't know what else to try and every time I see it it frustrates me that I can't figure it out, even with trial and error.

I'm sorry if this sounds whiny, it's just bugging the hell out of me :/
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: raekuul on December 06, 2011, 17:13
All I'm allowed to say is that, once you figure it out, you'll be kicking yourself over how simple it is.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Cheesybox on December 06, 2011, 19:49
I guess that helps. Is there anything that blocks you from being able to pick it up?
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Matt_S on December 06, 2011, 21:34
Quote from: raekuul on December 06, 2011, 17:13
All I'm allowed to say is that, once you figure it out, you'll be kicking yourself over how simple it is.
I'll keep this in mind if I ever find the Dragonslayer :/
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Zecks on December 07, 2011, 07:24
I have some ideas on how, but goddamn it I've had it spawn once and only once, since 0.9.9.1 I think?

I could probably try some Ao100 if I had the time.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: AlterAsc on December 07, 2011, 07:30
Quote
I've had number of games drop it, and my past 2 games in row dropped it as well
Now i know who stole DS generating from me.
Though maybe it's RNG punishing me because i know how to pick it up.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Ander Hammer on December 07, 2011, 08:42
I'd rather see the spawn rate upped, and/or the set guaranteed to generate - if one piece gets rolled, the other will show up later.

I have a very excellent (simple) theory that I've yet to ever be able to test, partly because I like guns too much and partly because I've seen the DS one time.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Zalminen on December 07, 2011, 09:33
I have a couple of ideas as well, but the only time I came across it was before I even knew it was different from the other uniques. I found it, figured I was missing a required trait or something and only bothered to check the Wiki/forum after I'd died...

Had I known there was some trick to it, I'd have done more experimenting.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Matt_S on December 07, 2011, 11:16
Strange... I seem to remember the wiki talk page for the Dragonslayer talking a bit about the mysterious requirements (nothing too revealing I thought), but the talk page is empty now...

EDIT: Ah, turns out the page was on the old wiki.

EDIT 2: Hehehe, I have a theory to try if I ever find it.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: IronBeer on December 07, 2011, 20:12
I've found a common trait in old mortems that managed to wield it, but I don't know if there's more than just that. I suspect I know how to wear the Berserker Armor as well, but I've not even had the two pieces spawn in the same game..... yet.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Bloax on December 07, 2011, 23:06
Quote from: raekuul on December 06, 2011, 17:13
All I'm allowed to say is that, once you figure it out, you'll be kicking yourself over how simple it is.
Like trying to pick it up without any weapons in your hand? ;P
[/whyamievenposting]
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Zalminen on December 08, 2011, 04:09
Quote from: Bloax on December 07, 2011, 23:06
Like trying to pick it up without any weapons in your hand? ;P
[/whyamievenposting]
I tried that with the Berserker Armor (actually dropped everything I was carrying first), don't know if it would work any better with DS. Maybe BA needs DS to use or maybe it has it's own trick, no idea.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Matt_S on December 08, 2011, 09:18
Here's the entry on the old wiki (http://old-wiki.chaosforge.org/wiki/index.php?title=Dragonslayer), for reference.  I won't say what my theory is, but I came up with it from reading this plus applying the "kicking yourself over how simple it is" principle.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Bloax on December 08, 2011, 09:59
Vampyre? :P

"No ordinary human."
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Matt_S on December 08, 2011, 11:39
Read the entire entry and look at the exact phrasing that's used for the quotes from the game.  Then think about everything that's in DoomRL.  I think you'll discover my theory.  No clue when I'll be able to test it, because I can't get very far in Ao100 and have yet to see the Dragonslayer.  Though I've apparently discovered the Berserker Armor 3 times.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: darksergio on December 08, 2011, 12:13
yeah I figure it after reading the entry but whit my shitty luck on uniques the sword never swamp for good sake RGN stop trolling me xD
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: AlterAsc on December 08, 2011, 12:27
Quote
Vampyre? :P

"No ordinary human."
No need to be a vampyre, it's easy :D (spoilers on berserk manga below)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: raekuul on December 08, 2011, 14:30
I thought that was for the Silent Glaive. Damn intercontinuity crossovers.

Hey, that reminds me, I've got something to add to the Horrible Ideas Thread...
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Cheesybox on December 08, 2011, 15:07
Well I can say vampyre/no weapons won't work either. Screw it. If yall want to have your secret club then whatever. I'm giving up on trying to wield this stupid thing.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: tiw on December 08, 2011, 17:42
Quote from: Cheesybox on December 08, 2011, 15:07
Well I can say vampyre/no weapons won't work either. Screw it. If yall want to have your secret club then whatever. I'm giving up on trying to wield this stupid thing.
First thing I'll do when the DoomRL source/core game modding tools come out is remove the horrible, horrible injoke.

As well as add silly and retarded assemblies, such as the ammo crapper.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Game Hunter on December 08, 2011, 19:44
I've never wielded the Dragonslayer (legitimately anyway, it's part of the IDKFA cheat but eh). I've probably seen it twice, ever, in any game at all. Even knowing what it does and how to get it, my reaction was summarized by an "okay cool" and not much else. Like a lot of stuff in the game, it can make things WAY too easy, which isn't the kind of fun I have with this game anyway.

Whenever people ask me how to get it, I just tell them to figure out what inspired it: this is more than enough to bring the conditions to a small set of possibilities, all of which can be feasibly attained and/or employed in the course of a single game. I don't really care whether or not it's a secret, but I also don't want to betray Kornel's trust by leaking it. Ultimately it's his decision.

Quote from: tiw on December 08, 2011, 17:42
First thing I'll do when the DoomRL source/core game modding tools come out is remove the horrible, horrible injoke.
As is totally expected, then, the current modding tools (0.9.9.4) allow you to spawn any item you want...except the Dragonslayer and Berserker Armor.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Deathwind on December 08, 2011, 20:12
I've yet to figure out it's new requirements but I think it's all in the traits...

As far as the source material goes I have read all of it (it starts great, turns to complete crap for an extended flashback and then gets better several volumes later)
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: VANDAM on December 12, 2011, 01:40
Look, there is a simple rule about DS: "Every character can wear it."
So, you should think, what are the general rules to wear it, than everything will be simple.
BTW. I think that berserk armor should be remade. 4 def is not that cool.
It's better to run with cerberus armor / Gothic armor. (And only on the last level wear BA)
Also AA should have some resists as well.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: UnderAPaleGreySky on December 12, 2011, 04:22
Quote from: VANDAM on December 12, 2011, 01:40
BTW. I think that berserk armor should be remade. 4 def is not that cool.
The Berserker Armour's defense is actually pretty interesting. If you only noticed a defense of 4, you probably weren't paying close enough attention to it. :3
Assuming it's been unchanged since .992, that is.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: VANDAM on December 12, 2011, 07:27
I also noticed UE Btw. and Apostle.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Bloax on December 12, 2011, 10:51
That reminds me, the only non-exploiting way to get Longinus Diamond seems to be getting the DS at exactly DLevel 16. :P
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Blahness on December 13, 2011, 04:08
I remember when I first saw the DS.

I picked it up, and became a god. 

Combine permazerk with gravity boots, and you can take up to 7 steps per ArchVile attack.  The mortuary was literally taking turns shooting at me.

Easiest endgame I've ever had in my life.

I've never been told explicitly not to tell anyone what the pickup requirements are, but I'm assuming posting them on this forum is a bad idea.  But, I will say that if a Dragonslayer spawns, it is pretty likely that you'll have the means to pick it up there and then.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Waterlemon on December 13, 2011, 16:43
Gee, OBVIOUSLY you just have to be BERSERK when you pick it up.

I mean that sounds simple enough, right? Well, maybe if it was that easy then it wouldn't be such a secret.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: IronBeer on December 13, 2011, 16:55
Quote from: Waterlemon on December 13, 2011, 16:43
Gee, OBVIOUSLY you just have to be BERSERK when you pick it up.

I mean that sounds simple enough, right? Well, maybe if it was that easy then it wouldn't be such a secret.
Been there, tried that. If it's a requirement, it's not the only one.

After some digging through old DS mortems, and finding some commonalities between them, plus what people have been saying around the forums, I think I know how to wield the Dragonslayer and wear the Berserker Armor. But I'm not 100% certain, and I won't spill it on the forums.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Blahness on December 13, 2011, 22:07
Yeah, I'm not allowed to post it on these forums. =|
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: Deathwind on December 14, 2011, 01:21
Being berserk was the old requirement but it was changed a few versions ago.
Title: Re: I hate to start another thread about the Dragonslayer but ugh
Post by: VANDAM on December 15, 2011, 06:41
I save scummed AO100 UV, now i wear BA+DS, so, UE love it.
BTW Apostle is not a real challenge.