Chaosforge Forum

DoomRL => Requests For Features => Topic started by: Derek on September 29, 2006, 23:21

Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Derek on September 29, 2006, 23:21
Maybe you already had this idea but it might be fun to have an unlockable Arena Mode where you are put in an area like Hell's Arena and you keep fighting until you die.  Every "round" more/harder monsters come in (along with weapons and health pickups).  The arena could change every five rounds or so to keep things fresh (I imagine after a few rounds you'd just have a big rectangle from all the explosions).

The stats you got could be kept as a score in your player profile, separate from the normal game.

This would also give you a chance to try and get as many traits as possible together (since the regular game is limited in the number of monsters you face)... create the ultimate warrior!
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: jake250 on September 30, 2006, 05:03
I am all for it. Would be fun for a blast.
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Thomas on September 30, 2006, 07:28
I love eet. I want it implemented now :D
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Turgor on September 30, 2006, 17:30
That would be a fun challenge..
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Jorge Alonso on October 01, 2006, 12:40
I love it too! Even levels with cybie/s, AoD/s, JC/s!
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Thomas on October 02, 2006, 06:44
To add to my post of "please put it in soon :D", I have a suggestion of how it could work in a late beta, or an early one of 0.9.A

(Unlocked with Imp and Sergeant)
Ass-kicking arena. Stairs don't appear until all enemies are dead, and you get healed after each fight. It goes on forever, until 10 cybies all gang up on you in a really low level and you die. The more levels you complete, the better.

(Unlocked with Demon)
Endurance arena. Powerups and enemies appear randomly. The more turns you survive, the better. The arena is smaller, and there are no stairs.

(Unlocked with Demon and Lieutenant)
Hardcore arena. The same as AK arena, but you don't have to kill all enemies for the stairs to appear and it's twice as hard.

(Unlocked with Cacodemon)
Boss arena. The same as AK arena, but enemies only appear 1 or 2 at a time and they're incredibly powerful. This may need arena-only enemies.

(Unlocked with Cacodemon and Lieutenant)
Melee arena. The same as AK arena, but you can only use melee weapons, which appear randomly.

(Unlocked with Hell knight and Captain)
Death arena. The same as Endurence arena, but no powerups appear except for rare health globes and supercharges, and the enemies are stronger.
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on October 03, 2006, 03:23
A definitive BIG YES to the idea, also a BIG YES to the ideas by Thomas :D. Arena challenges will be implemented, although I don't know if they will make it into 0.9.9 or 0.9.A...
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Derek on October 03, 2006, 03:53
Awesome! :D

Thomas, I like your ideas for different arenas, although a few of them are too similar for my taste (AK/Hardcore and Endurance/Death). :)

Maybe replace those two with "Deathmatch Arenas" that mimic real Doom multiplayer?  That is, instead of fighting hordes of monsters, you're fighting against a handful of Doom marines just like you.

Everyone starts out the same, with a pistol and a green armor, and you run for weapons and ammo (that regenerate).  Get the most number of frags in a given amount of time!

Another idea!  Co-op is always super fun... now, it would really mess up the rhythm of the normal game, but could be perfect for Arena modes.  I would call it "Two Versus Many" or something like that.  Essentially it is you and one other Doom marine against the hordes.  It'd be nice to finally have someone on your side for once!

The AI could check if you're low on health and drop a health pack for you, blast enemies that are threatening you, or otherwise just help you out.  He could also ask YOU for help...

Former human sargeant shoots.  Kornel is hit! Kornel says "Help, I need some cover fire over here!"



Another possibility is Team Deathmatch (2 v 2 or 4 v 4).

I don't know, this is probably going overboard.  It would be fun, though. :)
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on October 03, 2006, 14:34
Quoting: Derek
Maybe replace those two with "Deathmatch Arenas" that mimic real Doom multiplayer? That is, instead of fighting hordes of monsters, you're fighting against a handful of Doom marines just like you.

Hah, I did that one time -- I did DoomRL Arena as my AI project :-P. But that would have to be redone anyway :/. And it IS a large scope project :/
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: jake250 on October 03, 2006, 22:58
Quoting: Kornel Kisielewicz
Hah, I did that one time -- I did DoomRL Arena as my AI project :-P. But that would have to be redone anyway :/. And it IS a large scope project :/

You should consider it a "low priority" project. That could give you something to work on once you run out of idea and work (if you ever do :P)
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on October 03, 2006, 23:25
Quoting: jake250
You should consider it a "low priority" project. That could give you something to work on once you run out of idea and work (if you ever do :P)

LOL. DoomRL is a high-priority project. As far as med-priority projects go, a dozen lifetimes would not be enough for me :-P
Title: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Derek on October 05, 2006, 03:31
Quoting: Kornel Kisielewicz
Hah, I did that one time -- I did DoomRL Arena as my AI project :-P. But that would have to be redone anyway :/. And it IS a large scope project :/


It seems like the AI wouldn't have to be TOO much smarter than your average monster AI.  Just more of an emphasis on grabbing weapons and better inventory management.  With maybe some variables to define each marine's personality (preferred weapons, fighing style, etc.).  These could be set randomly.

But it's probably a can of worms not worth opening at this point. :)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on November 26, 2006, 10:49
I'm moving this topic to Discussions now -- it's no longer a secret, so maybe others want to comment on it :)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: KrisM on November 26, 2006, 12:08
It's like BerserkRL inside DoomRL :) I like it.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: aleksa6 on November 27, 2006, 00:20
Yeah, and if it were to go multiplayer, you could have turn by turn combat in that arena. No more a turn than 5 seconds to make it more challenging to aim!
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Valkeera on December 09, 2006, 08:52
Arenas in DooM? Wicked! I'm all for it! ;-)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Almafeta on December 09, 2006, 10:24
I'd ask for one change:  Let Pain Elemental-launched Lost Souls give you XP.

You could also experiment with new monsters and combinations of monsters that would be too dangerous in the normal modes.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Derek on December 09, 2006, 17:47
You could also experiment with new monsters and combinations of monsters that would be too dangerous in the normal modes.

Might be a nice place for the Spider Mastermind (the Arena Mastermind?). ;)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on December 20, 2006, 12:03
Me like! Me like ALOT!

But where is it in the discussion page...?
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Valkeera on December 27, 2006, 05:06
What about a "Defender of Hell" arena? In this challenge you would play a former commando (yes, the h) on a sigle level, and your goal would be to ward off the invasion of arrogant marines who think they can take on Hell itself. You would get exp and advance to higher levels, but instead of picking traits you would just get more health, improve in accuracy and damage. And of course, you can use the equipment dropped by fallen marines 8-)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on December 28, 2006, 07:19
Or you could start as a former human and go all the way up to AV (with some path options) - and ressurect marines as former foos!
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Valkeera on December 28, 2006, 11:33
And on Nightmare!, you would resurrect after a certain amount of time passes 8-)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: twiddybum on December 29, 2006, 21:36
With maybe the utimate goal being to conquer hell for your own purposes.. interesting.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on December 30, 2006, 06:25
Well well, I think we're on to something :P

Ok, then, maybe not a "monster to monster" upgrade path (it doesn't make too much sense to go from mindless zombie to cunning lord of hell when you're, well, mindless), but a list of different "campaigns", each with a different monster (possibly former foos could be packed into one, starting as former human and changing based on a set of weapon skill picks, and somhow the same for HKs and BoH).
You can pick to be the meanest bastard in hell (maybe only after winning/progressing with the lesser kin, like with skills), but that comes with massive resistance from the opposition - so AV games will be no piece of cake.
The challenge will consist of waves of opposition, followed by ability/equipment upgrades and other hellish benefits, and there'll be optional special levels, which are possibly premade, where you have to fulfill some objectives - point A to point B, capture the flag and so forth - for special benefits (like the AVs right to resurrect :) ).

And on Nightmare!, you would resurrect after a certain amount of time passes 8-)
I assume you were kidding :P , but aye! With water rising as a timer to kill everything (or you have to prevent a team from reaching the lever)!
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Derek on December 30, 2006, 18:52
I think the interesting aspect of the "play as the monster" idea isn't that you're a monster, but that you're a small part of a large horde going up against a single, but very powerful foe (the marine).  Otherwise, it's not that much different from playing a marine... you just have different weapons at your disposal.

But yeah, actually that's probably a better idea for a completely new 7DRL: you control one monster after another, trying to stop a single, overpowered human from getting to their goal.  The idea of playing as a large horde of creatures where the lives are insubstantial appeals to me somehow. :)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Adral on December 31, 2006, 02:30
I think the interesting aspect of the "play as the monster" idea isn't that you're a monster, but that you're a small part of a large horde going up against a single, but very powerful foe (the marine).  Otherwise, it's not that much different from playing a marine... you just have different weapons at your disposal.

But yeah, actually that's probably a better idea for a completely new 7DRL: you control one monster after another, trying to stop a single, overpowered human from getting to their goal.  The idea of playing as a large horde of creatures where the lives are insubstantial appeals to me somehow. :)

This is actually a pretty good idea! This would make the RL very different in the way of playing, thinking, etc. It would be similar to Dungeon Keeper, perhaps, and be more of a small strategy game where you have to control your minions to destroy that %$·%& marine who thinks he can banish evil than a RL per se :P.

Also we need to be a Cyberdemon. For great justice.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Aki on December 31, 2006, 03:39
Lolz 'For great justice'. I think we should play this arena somthing like this:
Code: [Select]
Move Baron of hell-->3W
###################
#...............#.#
#.====..s....0..#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====.V....A...#.#
#.====..........#C#
#.====..B.......#.#
#.====....XXXB..#.#
#.........@.....#.#
###################

Baron of Hell-->Attack-->#%$ Marine
###################
#...............#.#
#.====..s....0..#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====.V....A...#.#
#.====..........#C#
#.====..B.......#.#
#.====....B.....#.#
#.........@.....#.#
###################

Baron of Hell-->Attack With--> [a]cid ball\[m]elee\[s]hotgun
###################
#...............#.#
#.====..s....0..#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====.V....A...#.#
#.====..........#C#
#.====..B.......#.#
#.====....B.....#.#
#.........@.....#.#
###################

Your Baron of hell attacks! The Marine attacks! Your baron of hell dies.
The Marine attacks your Hell knight! The Marine attacks your Hell knight!
###################
#...............#.#
#.====..s....0..#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====.V....A...#.#
#.====..........#C#
#.====..B.......#.#
#.====....@.....#.#
#...............#.#
###################
And look mode:
Code: [Select]
Look-->You(Cyberdemon)
###################
#...............#.#
#.====..s....0..#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====.V....A...#.#
#.====..........#C#
#.====..B.......#-#
#.====.......B..#.#
#.........@.....#.#
###################
And when that marine breaks into your hidey spot after wiping the floor with your minions:

Code: [Select]
Attack-->#%@# Marine-->With-->[r]ocket\[m]elee\[h]idden group of 20 commando's >=)
###################
#...............#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====..........#.#
#.====............#
#.====...........C#
#.====..........#.#
#.====....@.....#.#
#...............#.#
###################

and for a mortem mabye...
--------------------------------------------------------------
 DoomRL (v.0.9.8.5) roguelike post-mortem character dump (Arena)
--------------------------------------------------------------

 1337 Cybieh dude, CyberDemon, killed by That Marine
 on level 24 of the Phobos base.
 He survived 10000 turns and scored 90000 points.

 He Managed his Minions Effectivly (4 Marine kills)

-- Statistics ------------------------------------------------

  Health -4/200 
  ToHit +0  ToDmg Ranged +6  ToDmg Melee +6


-- Minions Managed -----------------------------------------------------

    120 former humans
    72 former sergeants
    43 former captains
    53 former commandos
    39 imps
    64 demons
    9 lost souls
    4 Hell Knights
    3 Barons of hell
    4 Aracnotrons
    92 Arch-Viles
    4 Pain elementals

-- History ---------------------------------------------------

 He started his Empire as a lowly Imp.
 After damaging 2 Marines and showing initive, The forces of hell turned him into a demon.
 After damaging 3 Marines and showing initive, The forces of hell turned him into a Hell Knight, giving him
 Command over some Minions.
 After damaging 4 Marines, Killing 1 and showing initive, The forces of hell turned him into a Baron of hell,
 giving him command over more minions.
 He was then Cyberneticly enanced and Given command of All minions.

-- General ---------------------------------------------------
Before him 17 other Imps failed to build an empire, on a fools quest to rule hell.
Beside them 8 Hell Knights were brought to their knees, taking with them more than others could.
Others witnessed 3 Barons of Hell as they rised most violently,
and proceeded to scorch the earth as they burnt out.

Throughout it all, though, the Cyberdemon has been killed 2 times.
Despair, mortals, for he will never truely die.

Wadda ya think?

Thx to TFoN for the general thingy.
--------------------------------------------------------------
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on December 31, 2006, 13:17
Nice :)
I was thinking of it all more as the demons attacking *before* the marine's counter-attack, or the last demons on the near-earth outposts holding their ground against "normal" marines.
Yeah, not very special, but that's how I pictured it, and still think it should be implemented.

Anyway, IMO, "One achieved Hell Knight rank before being killed" sounds better, as he ain't an Imp any longer, and deserves recognition :P, and:
Before him 17 other Imps failed to build an empire, on a fools quest to rule hell.
Beside them 8 Hell Knights were brought to their knees, taking with them more than others could.
Others witnessed 3 Barons of Hell as they rised most violently,
and proceeded to scorch the earth as they burnt out.

Throughout it all, though, the Cyberdemon has been killed 2 times.
Despair, mortals, for he will never truely die.
sounds to me even better.
The idea is that those who reached a certain rank were destined to or were it, and, furthermore, the idea behind the Cyberdemon line is that he's possibly reincarnated, and not resurrected or rebuilt, and only his corrupt soul could possibly survive the path to Hell's Kingship!
Naturally, each line makes the dead dude look better, considering the ~feudal system :P
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Aki on December 31, 2006, 14:29
There TFoN, i did your general in the mortem =)

ANyone else got any ideas?
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Malek Deneith on January 01, 2007, 13:27
Lol. What Aki shown remins me of Final Fantasy Tactics xP
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Aki on January 01, 2007, 13:38
Arrgh. Dont put down FFT *waves a big cutlass*

But is my idea any good?
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Malek Deneith on January 01, 2007, 16:26
Arrgh. Dont put down FFT *waves a big cutlass*
Eh? What's wrong with FFT? O.o (As for the idea it might be interesting :P)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Adral on January 01, 2007, 17:37
But is my idea any good?

Yep, I like it, but perhaps it would be better if you start already as a Cyberdemon and each time your minions kill a marine you get some "upgrade menu" to make yourself/your minions/the level in general harder for the marine. I think starting as a lowly hellspawn would get us killed too many times :P.

EDIT: Spelling.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Aki on January 01, 2007, 18:50
Arrgh. Dont put down FFT *waves a big cutlass*
Eh? What's wrong with FFT? O.o (As for the idea it might be interesting :P)
I said don't put it down, but i see you think theirs nothing wrong with it.
But is my idea any good?


But is my idea any good?

Yep, I like it, but perhaps it would be better if you start already as a Cyberdemon and each time your minions kill a marine you get some "upgrade menu" to make yourself/your minions/the level in general harder for the marine. I think starting as a lowly hellspawn would get us killed too many times :P.

EDIT: Spelling.
I dont think that would be a good idea.
Looking from that marines point of view, its like:
You go down the stairs to level 4.
Suddenly 10 BoH's attack you! You die....

So Either way, it could work.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on January 06, 2007, 13:21
There TFoN, i did your general in the mortem =)

Ok, I just plain didn't understand that sentence :)
Run that by me again?


Yep, I like it, but perhaps it would be better if you start already as a Cyberdemon and each time your minions kill a marine you get some "upgrade menu" to make yourself/your minions/the level in general harder for the marine.
Afterall, Cyberdemons are cybernetic. Sweet :)

Quote
I think starting as a lowly hellspawn would get us killed too many times :P.
Unless your victims start small, too. If you're trying to build an empire in hell, your first kills are likely to be your own kin and/or their [lesser] enemies.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Aki on January 06, 2007, 13:39
There TFoN, i did your general in the mortem =)

Ok, I just plain didn't understand that sentence :)
Run that by me again?


Yep, I like it, but perhaps it would be better if you start already as a Cyberdemon and each time your minions kill a marine you get some "upgrade menu" to make yourself/your minions/the level in general harder for the marine.
Afterall, Cyberdemons are cybernetic. Sweet :)

Quote
I think starting as a lowly hellspawn would get us killed too many times :P.
Unless your victims start small, too. If you're trying to build an empire in hell, your first kills are likely to be your own kin and/or their [lesser] enemies.

I should've put:
THere TFoN, i put your General LInes in the mortem.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Adral on January 06, 2007, 13:44
Unless your victims start small, too. If you're trying to build an empire in hell, your first kills are likely to be your own kin and/or their [lesser] enemies.

Yes, but since it's easy to grow tired of the Random Stupid Early Death Syndrome, I proposed that:P. I guess your proposal makes sense too, it's just that, being a Cyberdemon, you already start as the "King" so you are all in for the dirty work since turn 1.

Could be an alternate playing mode. :P
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on January 06, 2007, 13:55
I should've put:
THere TFoN, i put your General LInes in the mortem.
Gotcha'.

Yes, but since it's easy to grow tired of the Random Stupid Early Death Syndrome, I proposed that:P. I guess your proposal makes sense too, it's just that, being a Cyberdemon, you already start as the "King" so you are all in for the dirty work since turn 1.

Could be an alternate playing mode. :P
Aye, indeed, more ideas is what this is all about :)
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Aki on January 07, 2007, 03:36
we need more ideas people =)


Unless your victims start small, too. If you're trying to build an empire in hell, your first kills are likely to be your own kin and/or their [lesser] enemies.

Yes, but since it's easy to grow tired of the Random Stupid Early Death Syndrome, I proposed that:P. I guess your proposal makes sense too, it's just that, being a Cyberdemon, you already start as the "King" so you are all in for the dirty work since turn 1.

Could be an alternate playing mode. :P

Like an un-lockable if you do enough? IMHO the starting with power is to OP...
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: TFoN on January 07, 2007, 14:41
(I'll assume OP means overpowered)

Again, that depends only on what the player's up against.
An example to end all examples [on this one :) ] is that playing a god isn't overpowered if you're dealing with three other gods.
Title: Re: Idea: Arena Mode
Post by: Adral on January 07, 2007, 14:56
(I'll assume OP means overpowered)

Again, that depends only on what the player's up against.
An example to end all examples [on this one :) ] is that playing a god isn't overpowered if you're dealing with three other gods.

Yep, if instead of fighting agaisnt a lone marine - which, mind you, is capable to kill a Cyberdemon even with his bare hands...

/me looks at Blade...

...he is up to fight squadrons of marines armed with BFGs, we could argue that being a Cyberdemon is dying on turn 2. So the opposition is what's more important, in my opinion.

I proposed being a Cyberdemon because it would be cool, and could lend us to cybernetical improvements as TFoN noted. Also, if a lone marine is scary for a Cyberdemon, imagine how scary can it be for a former human :P.