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Messages - Sambojin

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It really just depends. I play on console mode mostly, so I was taking plenty of damage due to walking through lava (which looks the same as blood splatters in text mode). After a bit of a play around, I'd have to agree, it probably is a lot easier than the Mortuary once you know the layout. Radar-shooting the islands etc make it not too much of a trouble really. Oh well. I'll leave the save up just for a laugh (it's quite therapeutic to go berko with rockets and BFGs sometimes).

Discussion / Limbo training 101 - with saves (massive spoilers)
« on: October 04, 2013, 04:05 »
In another part of my very ad-hoc series, I thought I'd put up a savegame for one of the newer HARD levels, so whoever wants to can get in some practice on it. Limbo, ie: the even eviler Mortuary.

How different is Limbo to the Mortuary? Very. For one, it's harder. Second, there's lava all over the place. Third, stuff just seems to be harder to kill. It gives the same rewards as the Mortuary, but it'll kill you deader, quicker (like the original wasn't bad enough). Knockback into said lava destroys as much life as the enemies do, groups end up spread out more (making BFGs and rockets less effective, though shotguns are slightly better) and there's a higher chance of viles spawning near you (not exactly a bad thing, except that they tend to surround you more often).

So this save is just a little thing for newer players to get a bit of practice with if they want. It also gives me somewhere to leave a save online so I can practice a bit from different PCs when I'm bored. It is save-scumming, so preferably do it in a fresh install of DoomRL ( so you won't end up changing your player record (there's no 100% kill-rate or anything on the save, but best to not sully your records with my feeble attempts).

The save makes the level as easy as possible, with as many options for tackling it as I could get into one save. It's a MFa run on HNTR, with WK(2) and Jug for weapon switching. Heaps of shells, cells and rockets and an onyxed red armour. A tac shotty, a F.DB shotty, a laser rifle, a bulked BFG and a rather silly missile launcher. There's a bit of other random stuff (nukes, phases, a medikit and a skull) to try stuff out with as well. You start with a fair bit of invincibility, berserk, and a heap of life, so you'll be good to muck around a bit if you want.

It was just one of those freak runs where the game front loads mods and weapons at you, even before you can use them, but it's handy for practicing a few different styles of play in Limbo.

It actually doesn't get easier than this, so hopefully players can get a bit of a feel for the level with the save. The filename is: "save_fireangel_limbo." Copy it to your DoomRL directory and remove everything from the filename other than the word "save."  Load up DoomRL and press continue.

Have fun (and rocket everything. Or plasma it. Whatever.)

Discussion / Re: Whizkid, Modpack Rarity, and Assemblies
« on: October 03, 2013, 20:44 »
Nope. Could have sworn I've gotten an A mod off of my tech modded shotty at one point though. But I'm kind of stupid and forgetful, so it might not have happened. I have this love/hate thing going with DoomRL where it gives me more stuff than I could ever use to complete the game, or it gives me nothing. It might have been on one of those "oodles of stuff" runs. I'll test it this arvo.

That would make a lot more sense though. Otherwise it'd be the most abuseable and amazing mastertrait in the game.

Everyone can completely disregard my previous post until then.

Discussion / Re: Whizkid, Modpack Rarity, and Assemblies
« on: October 03, 2013, 20:27 »
Another small point on the mastertrait:

That starting tech mod and the two from CC+ are golden. EE enhanced chaingun fire will get you through the arena (or tech modded shotty cornershots), and accurate rockets destroy the AM in CC+. It doesn't really matter what mods you get from it, as soon as you get Scavenger, you can definately get what you need. It may not be from the rare mods selection, but you can always end up with the basic or advanced assembly of your choice (that doesn't use a rare mod) as soon as you get Scavenger.

Mod a weapon, destroy a weapon, get a new random mod-pack. If it's not the one you want, repeat the process.

To me that's pretty damn powerful.
(was this changed in to only have a percentage chance of a mod-pack return? I'll have to do a couple of runs on HNTR to check).

Discussion / Re: Whizkid, Modpack Rarity, and Assemblies
« on: October 03, 2013, 20:11 »
I'd have to agree that going straight for Int(2) would be the best option. EE(2) makes chainguns fairly useable as a backup weapon early on. You've also got that handy little tech mod that you start with. A T1-shotgun (or chaingun) is actually a pretty useable weapon. As soon as your mastertrait comes online, dis-assemble it to get another random mod.

It's not as though it's a horrible mastertrait. Even unmodded plasma rifles become useful killers with their high EE enhanced accuracy, but your's will definately be modded. SoB(2) still works wonders, so I'm not sure why you think that you can't rapid-fire with the trait. Shotguns, RLs, MLs, plasma rifles and even BFGs all get a lot better with high accuracy and the wonders of Int(2). Admittedly, they'd be that good without the mastertrait, but the Scavenger ability is just a nice little bonus on top of everything. You can un-mod your start-off weapons and you'll usually get around 2-3 extra mods throughout the game by destroying exotics/uniques. It's not uber-powerful, but it's not bad either. It does give you a chance at getting those normally completely unrealistic assemblies and mod combos in a normal game, which is pretty good in my opinion. I'll have to put up some mortems with really dumb/good mod-combos at some point.

Could it use a boost? Probably. Is it bad? Not really.

Discussion / Re: A stack of questions.
« on: October 03, 2013, 00:39 »
Away from you is great, or rather "to the right area". Door control and LOS is your friend. Enemies don't ever close doors. You can.

Doorways are more than N! corpse stackers. There's a few map types where gifts, door destruction (so you can barrel block it) and timing are great. One doorway draws them. The other is a kaboom of fun.

Anyways, I'll happily say that not all of these techniques can be easily used at all times. But DoomRL does have many advantages of being a strategic roguelike as well as the normal type. It's not Sokaban-with-barrels, but it's not corner-shoot-for-the-WIN!. Except, sometimes it can be both or neither. When it's not RNG and stuff.

Lovely game.

Discussion / Re: A stack of questions.
« on: October 02, 2013, 22:37 »
Errrm, some other tips, with a double post and all. Non-RNG or class dependant (sort of)
Gift dropping in AoB and AoMr (especially on UV):

It might seem like it's playing the system, but Line-of-sight in DoomRL is a bit screwy. I can't say if all advice here represents the current state of play, some of it is from previous versions.

I'm not sure if it's still the case, but HKs and Barons used to pick up ammo. It used to be worthwhile to give them a stack of shells, without any problems. No gain for them, but a chainsaw to the face or a hail of pistol shots for their troubles. One turn of "duh? SHELLS. MINE!" was great in any challenge mode. The AI has changed. Do they still do this?

Wear some armour early for the simple point of having it damaged whilst you kill things. You will take some damage early on anyway. In AoB, keep your inital blue perfect, or at ~24%. Greens are great too. Remember to stock up on busted armour. In AoB and AoMr you only have a few viable weapons. Therefore you have a couple of slots for gift drops. One is never enough. A former will die easily, but if you're assailed by HKs and formers early, two is great. Drop one of them back from a doorway a square, then another the next square back from that. Once one is grabbed, the next is still a noticeable gift-drop, thus funneling formers and surrounding HKs to the same area. Since you'll be standing beside said doorway, anything near will go into melee mode.

The reverse of this: Sometimes you want wandering enemies to just wander off. They haven't seen you, but one of their friends has noticed your gift. Specifically for AoMr, 1-on-1 is fine. Two gifts can make a horde-group that you don't want to deal with.

Strategic map control:

Close the f'ing doors. It's important. There's a lot of things that don't open doors. The things that do make sound when they open the doors. Close the doors. You're a space marine. Clean each area and seal it behind you. If you open up the entire level and wonder why something you didn't see on the first run through hits you a couple of times, it's your fault. You didn't close the doors.

Barrels of acid/lava. If you don't specifically need them now, group them the best you are able to in that room, near a closed door or at a nice area to shoot/melee into preferably (from another doorway or choke-point). Drop a gift beside them. You now have a small area with bonus damage. Drop 3 gifts if you have to. You might get a gathering of enemies that need bonus damage done to them. Not all challenges let you use rockets, all of them let you use barrels.

Barrel corner shoot. Push a barrel near a corner/wall-vision-stop. Drop a gift near it. Shoot/knife-throw the barrel to death after a few turns of waiting. AoE corner shooting in action.

Enemies are dumb. They either won't walk anywhere near acid/lava, will walk/fly right through it, or will take plenty of damage wandering through it. Terrain/walls/rivers and barrel-pops are your friend. Honestly, even when you're not taking much notice, you're better at dealing with this sort of stuff than the hellspawn you'll face.

Edit: I'm a bit of a grammar-nazi on myself. The internet's international, so I vaguely try and make my posts more understandable. Sometimes. 

Discussion / Re: A stack of questions.
« on: October 02, 2013, 21:10 »
Well, I edited my post a little so there was some actual advice in there. But since you're doing AoB runs as well, the best advice is to learn when to run. For Aob and AoMr. That 20% movespeed & dodge increase is the only "tactical" option you have over HKs and faster enemies in the early game. It is somewhat RNG dependant, but eventually you'll look at every medikit and health globe as a run-booster with a small health side-effect rather than the other way around. They're also great for any run, but very important on the "harder" challenges.
Tactic resets from globes and medikits are probably your most important finite resource in the early game. You can't guarantee how many you'll get, but you can decide where and when to use them. Thus, they're not entirely RNG dependant, even if the amount of them, the dodging chances and situations surrounding them are. The 20% movespeed is nicely static, so's when you hit TAB to use them. AoB is the best way to learn how important this is, but don't forget it for any challenge or game-type.

Incidently, there's a youTube video showing how to kill the angel of death in the cathedral with a throwing knife. Ring-a-ring-a-rosie style, but you do need a certain build for it (HR to the rescue. An armour-piercing knife wouldn't hurt either). 

Discussion / Re: A stack of questions.
« on: October 02, 2013, 20:33 »
Just as a point, masterless pistol builds are still very viable for all classes. MGK and MSs are still great, but so are things like Jug (essentially a free reload for your pistol (more if not doing challenges and doing weapon quick switch abuse)), Int(2) is the joy that it always is and HR and TaN do their normal thing. EE is exceptional in masterless pistol builds as well, but SoG and DG tend to come first.

But as your questions are centred around AoMr in UV, it makes it a bit of a harder question to answer on "how to win". Actually, just saying "I'd like to not rely on the RNG" makes it a hard question to answer. If you don't want to rely on it, do lots of runs, otherwise it'll throw you curve balls that no amount of advice can fix.

Try a SoG->SoG->Fin->Jug build some time. It's kind of like mini-MGK-without-DG, but earlier. As you (hopefully) pick up more types of pistols, primary/secondary them and switch around as ammo is required. DG does offer more DPS, Fin isn't half as good as SoG, but Jug sometimes makes it worth it. B/P/T ahoy later in the game, modding the hell out of your pistols with WK. But really, SoG can get you through the arena, it's just not easy (plus you do need a little luck on enemy spawns and health/medikits before it).

Are you hitting "run" a fair bit? When things get in close, sometimes the extra move speed and dodging is good enough to make up for the -2 accuracy, but it depends on the situation.

Actually, saying that you'd like to 100% an AoB run on UV or N! makes it hard to offer specific advice as well. What advice can someone give you on level 2-3 when there's 3 HKs bearing down on you? Don't die? Or just die and restart? Sometimes roguelikes are cruel, sometimes you just die. It really doesn't matter how good of a player you are, sometimes you lose regardless.
It sounds like you're well on your way to beating these particular challenges, but it often doesn't happen every time. Try masterless pistol runs, and pray to the RNG that it throws just enough, but not too much, at you early on in AoB. Probably not the advice you're looking for.......

Discussion / Re: Another Doom tribute: Triangle Doom
« on: September 27, 2013, 02:45 »
Anyway, I'll chuck something up here when I've got something to show. Give it a burl when it's half done, just so I've got reasonable feedback from a damn good forum that knows these things. Poor Wouter doesn't even know how good of an engine for roguelikes that he's got. No sound, no multiplayer, but that's by decision. And typo's. And stuff. It sort of needs sound and multiplayer. Whatever. Damn good engine anyway.

Mwahahahahahahahaha. I need something to do until NewIPRL gets any real form of design from the godhand. Mwahahahahahah. And stuff.

Discussion / Re: Another Doom tribute: Triangle Doom
« on: September 27, 2013, 01:51 »
After some convencense and thought (ie: drinking cheap wine) I've decided to go ahead with the mod for Triangle Wizard.

I'll be able to do race/class/god combo's (even hardcoded bits of it) as Angel of *foo* and master-trait beginnings. A massive shift to incantantion pickups and spell/weapon pickups (considering that there will be all of 8 of them to begin with) is simply a different levelling path. It may be the weapons you don't have that determines your character build. Storage is fine, it's just more ammo. Spell regen will be amazingly pricey (considering the gold enemies drop and their stats, even on shop levels).

Meh, whatever. I'm going to do it. A mod for Triangle Wizard. Triangle Doom. Not at all roguelike. Not even like DoomRL roguelike. But, there might be a few references. I hope Kornel doesn't sue me.

Discussion / Re: Another Doom tribute: Triangle Doom
« on: September 26, 2013, 21:37 »
Indeed. But it is always useful to know the lay of the land that you may walk in.

So Triangle Doom, a tribute to Doom it is.

Discussion / Re: Another Doom tribute: Triangle Doom
« on: September 26, 2013, 21:15 »
Just so we're all clear on this:


Parody: Both the original creators of the game (iDSoftware), and the game itself (Doom) was considered a leap forward in graphics technology in the first-person-shooter genre of computer games. DoomRL is a step back from that, having for many versions only used alphabetical characters to represent enemies/level-layout/items/etc, and now basic 2-D pixel-art representing all facets of the game necessary to show to the player. That a simple group of alphabetical characters or small "icons" on a monitor can signify terror to the player allows the nature of the parody in comparison to the original and is shown in graphical terms. Also, for a real-time, first-person-shooter with (at the time excellent) graphics to be re-portrayed in very basic two-dimensional graphical nature, or with text characters, shows it's basic humour at a portrayal of the parody in a graphical nature.

Humour: There are so many references to so many other games/creations/people/IPs in DoomRL, most of them described in a nonchalant or humorous manner, that such humour is not directed at any particular IP, nor in a disparaging manner. The humour is there upon many angles, towards many sources in pop-culture. It is this attitude contained in DoomRL that gives is it's overall "feel", regardless of it's basis in IP, it is not simply directed towards a particular IP or "game-world".

Entertainment value: Many players of the game DoomRL have played it for rather significant amounts of time, numbering in the hundreds of hours of play-time in some cases across all versions that have been released. That it has entertained an audience of players for this amount of time shows it has entertainment value.

Economic value: DoomRL does gain Chaosforge some donations, but it is free to both download and play for all users with the full set of features and gameplay options available to the user upon this free download regardless of donations given. It does not cost anything to play the game, therefore does not take any purchasing power away from any particular individual. If the user wishes to purchase any product from any particular IP, from any particular developer or company, they may, and have just as much purchasing power as they did before playing DoomRL.

I'm not trying to muck with you thelaptop, or Kornel, but I tend to think I could make a pretty good case in court if anyone gave you a C&D order and tried to follow it through.   

Discussion / Re: Another Doom tribute: Triangle Doom
« on: September 26, 2013, 20:01 »
I'm aware of the juxtaposition that DoomRL holds under current IP laws. It is a tribute in an entirely different genre as well as a parody of sorts. It has both humour and entertainment value, does not disparage against the original IP, and is of an entirely different gameplay form (increasing consumer confidence of the original IP as well as being entirely donation driven, therefore taking no sales away from the original IP).

So, not a problem. I know where you're coming from, so I'll base my mod off Doom, and not DoomRL. But because I'm cool, there will be references to one of the best roguelikes ever made.

Discussion / Another Doom tribute: Triangle Doom
« on: September 26, 2013, 18:43 »
In my somewhat ill disciplined and never-on-time tinkering in the world of roguelikes, I've decided to do a Doom tribute based on another pseudo-roguelike engine. My initial idea was to do it under the X@com engine, but it was a bit fiddly, yet very cool. I'll probably come back to it at some stage (the X@com engine is one of the most sophisticated ascii roguelike engines currently (sort-of) in development. X@com: The Fall of Mars will be completed one day as a mission/mod-pack).

So what other engine could convey the Doom style experience in a roguelike manner? The roguelike style experience specifically? Well, there's one. Triangle Wizard. I do a little bit of bug-hunting and typo fixing from time to time for the dev, so I'm fairly familiar with it's workings. It's also completely moddable, with enemies, spells (weapons), items, etc all changeable very easily. It also happens to be a realtime-roguelike engine, giving you more of an opportunity for circle-strafing goodness. There's also the matter of particle effects. Lots of particle and graphical effects.

Strangely enough, the mod would be a regression of the basic Triangle Wizard gameplay. Less weapons (spells), less enemies, less items. Some of the mechanics will have to be mucked around with (reload is essentially casting speed, spell regen virtually doesn't exist (it's a nano pack worth's of goodness), armour is resistance items, a chainsaw is a decent melee weapon), but I think it can be done. Rather easily in this case.

So the point of this post is: should I go ahead and do this thing? It's just for a bit of fun and so I can draw more attention to Doom, a certain excellent roguelike and Triangle Wizard, simply because they're some of my favourite games. Would you play it if it was done well? Can you think of any major stumbling blocks (assuming you understand T.Wizard modding. Currently both levelling traits, class/race/god combos and mod-packs are on my "I'll have to work out something" list.)? Would you think of it as a horrible thing to do (considering I should be doing graphics/concepts for something else right now)?

Hell, I'll throw in some Doom Arsenal tribute mod references as well. Just so it's about the 4th step along in the game/roguelike/game/roguelike chain of Doom tributes :)

Edit: f'ing advocates. Yes, this is fair use. Just, but justly.

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