Chaosforge Forum
General => Discussion => Topic started by: Daqin on November 28, 2007, 01:12
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Hi
I wonder what you think of making RL in SW theme. I mean old StarWars (personally I pretend that new ones don't exist..). I was for long time under affection to it and it would be cool if some SW roguelike existed. However I am bit afraid that Lucas may be sort of shark on rights. SO I don't know.
But I know I would like to see old Starwars atmosphere with stormtroopers, blasters, droids and subtle Force (new one doesn't really seem to fit into what was previously created)
So, maybe StarWarsRL in 7 days ? Y>
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Good idea, Starwars Battlefront Roguelike would be very nice! It would be even cooler if you could replay the whole starwars story as a RL! =D
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Yea, whole story.. really cool. I was always sad about that there is no really good SW game (except simulators and maybe FP shooters), no strategy (maybe Rebellion, but it still wasn't THAT) and no RPG (Jedi of old Republic was nice game but somehow I like atmosphere of old Starwars).
In first place I think I miss good space combat fleet strategy game (plus characters, planets and economy, bases etc) but focused on tactical space combat. Small 2D fighting in turns maybe.
Secondly I miss good RPG or roguelike where you have character or characters. And story line interweaving with oryginal story (for example: you are Tatooine native in remote village on travel for resources to Mos Eisley. You meet old hermit in odd circumstances and find yourself involved in strange activities. You help with some cargo on a ship that carries some bothans. On return journey ,which seems more like escape, they are anxious to deliver some plans to somewhere and you are the person that might help. You are to meet some representative and pass the thing to some kind of diplomatic official on corellian corvette class ship coming at Tatooine orbit in the following days... )
Heh ;)
Eh, Lucas Arts looks more like cheap commercial crap these days unfortunatelly, and we need some good games.
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Hi
I wonder what you think of making RL in SW theme. I mean old StarWars (personally I pretend that new ones don't exist..). I was for long time under affection to it and it would be cool if some SW roguelike existed. However I am bit afraid that Lucas may be sort of shark on rights.
LucasArts definitely is more aggressive about enforcing intellectual property than many other corporations.
But I know I would like to see old Starwars atmosphere with stormtroopers, blasters, droids and subtle Force (new one doesn't really seem to fit into what was previously created)
Agreed; that was a pretty gross rewrite.
However, Lucas' background notes seem so extensive that even if it was a retrocon, it was one that he technically executed well. (Whether the retrocon actually improves the setting is another question entirely.)
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(Whether the retrocon actually improves the setting is another question entirely.)
Exactly. Personaly I believe that it would be better if Lucas never made new trilogy. He kinda got burned out in those years satisfied with what was previously made and taking all 'worship' for granted. New jedi knights seem more like show-off acrobats, arrogant, making silly jokes and mean faces, etc. Actually they seem more like Sith to me.
Old SW is nice though.
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Yeah, the original Jedi Knight series, and X-Wing and TIE Fighters were the best!
/me was a big SW fan for a loooong time.
BTW, I don't consider those three new high-budget fan films as canon :P.
As for a SW roguelike, yeah I did consider it, but I'm sure that LA would crack up on it before it became even remotely popular. My idea however was a Jedi Academy kind of roguelike -- where you start as a Padawan and increase in skill and afterwards go out on missions throughout the galaxy. Yeah, a Jedi RL would be MUCH fun :).
I did even a unfinished single-player mud in this setting, but it never got polished...
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As for a SW roguelike, yeah I did consider it, but I'm sure that LA would crack up on it before it became even remotely popular. My idea however was a Jedi Academy kind of roguelike -- where you start as a Padawan and increase in skill and afterwards go out on missions throughout the galaxy. Yeah, a Jedi RL would be MUCH fun :).
Maybe cover it with non-SW name ? I doubt anyone would give it out. Hard to tell if LA people search through roguelikes. Maybe change names, like st0rmtr00pers, J3di Knights etc., or even stormtropers, Jedii Knights.. I don't know how the law speaks on these things though.
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That would destroy the feel IMHO. I'd rather publish it under an alias and put it on a russian server :P
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I'd rather publish it under an alias and put it on a russian server :P
You would.. ? ;>
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Bah! Only when I promised myself not to waste time on Internet forums I find topic like this... ;)
What can I say... I could basically sign myself under Daqin's posts - and I rarely meet a SW fan with similar views on the subject... I, too, miss times when X-Wing, Dark Forces and TIE Fighter rocked the world. I, too, crave for a full blown strategy game set in this universe or a fine RPG (KOTOR was OK, but it's not a real SW to me - for SW you need Empire, Rebellion, Vader, X-Wings, Stormtroopers and so on...).
I even discussed gaming subject on some SW forums, but these are overrun with geeks who have grown into trolls (because Internet gives them false feeling of anonymity and security). I was hoping to rally some people, but I only wasted my time.
If there are few people who could pull this off one of them has to be Kornel. This guy can see his things done (we've got like 4? playable games) and they turn out highly playable as well.
But I'm also worried about LFL/LEC response ("C&D letter", ya know). Yet I hope this could be somehow classified as "fan-made stuff", and especially recently they've started encouraging making fan-content.
I do have several concepts and a general vision of how such game could be done - we could also seek help at other SW-related forums (some of which I used to frequent).
But I'd need Kornel's response - I'm not gonna start daydreaming and typing all of this if it serves no purpose...
It would be even cooler if you could replay the whole starwars story as a RL! =D
Well, if you want to see SW in ASCII you can go here: http://www.asciimation.co.nz (http://www.asciimation.co.nz) ;D
And here...
only to tease you...
(of course this "screenshot" is fake)
#........# | |
#........# | Maat, Level 1 Rebel Trooper|
#........# | |
#....r...# | Health Armor: Rebel Vest |
#........# | **********************99/99|
#...T....# | Weapon: BlasTech E-11 rifle|
#........# | ***********-----------46/99|
#........# | |
######################....#######################| Sidearm: DL-34 Blaster Pist|
#..S..S.%...............................R........| Main W.: BlasTech E-11 Rifl|
=V................-....-.....-......-.@..........| Grenade: Merr-Sonn Detonatr|
=...S..S...-......-.......-.......-..............| |
#.S...................................%..R.......| STR: 10 |
######################....#######################| DEX: 14 |
#........# | INT: 13 |
#........# | |
#........# | Bacta Canisters: 2 |
#........# | Blaster energy packs: 1 |
#........# | Grenades: 1 |
-------------------------------------------------| |
The Stormtrooper fires! The Stormtrooper misses | |
you! The Stormtrooper misses you! The Rebel | |
Trooper dies! You reload your E-11 Rifle with | |
blaster energy pack. You see: a Stormtrooper | |
(heavily wounded) Press (m) for more. | |
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Darth Vader looks at you. Darth Vader clenches his hand in a fist! You're choking! You're choking! You're choking! You're choking! You die...
xD
Actually if I were to make a StarWars roguelike it would be set in the Jedi Academy era -- right after Skywalker established it on Yavin IV. Why? Because I'd like believable and playable Jedi characters, and the Academy stuff opens a lot of room for quests.
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In that case I'm afraid I can't yield my support, because: a) I'm not into post-ROTJ era of Expanded Universe b) I'm not fond of all this Jedi stuff.
So I have to say goodbye to the concept of a galactic scruffy looking rogue/smuggler/mercenary...
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OTOH, Han Solo was definitively my favourite character xP
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You are a reasonable man, so let me put it in this way:
A Jedi-focused game would be based primarily on melee combat (lightsabers) plus Force powers (~magic). Scoundrel/smuggler/mercenary-oriented SW game would feature mostly firefights with some addition of melee "for spice" (like DoomRL). For me melee combat in roguelike games is always... well, a bit like ASCII porn: surely you can imagine what are they doing but you'd like to see some detail :D What I mean is that it's easier to make a working and playable combat system which focuses on projectile weapons (like DoomRL) to a system which prefers melee fighting - which requires extensive skills, tactics, modes and various other factors to make it balanced (like the concept of pain in Berserk). Otherwise it would be a bit boring (just bounce the enemies till one of you die).
I think I'm gonna send you PM.
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You are a reasonable man [...]
l loled :D
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You are a reasonable man, so let me put it in this way:
LOL! I write ROGUELIKES... how can I be reasonable? xD
A Jedi-focused game would be based primarily on melee combat (lightsabers) plus Force powers (~magic). Scoundrel/smuggler/mercenary-oriented SW game would feature mostly firefights with some addition of melee "for spice" (like DoomRL). For me melee combat in roguelike games is always... well, a bit like ASCII porn: surely you can imagine what are they doing but you'd like to see some detail :D What I mean is that it's easier to make a working and playable combat system which focuses on projectile weapons (like DoomRL) to a system which prefers melee fighting - which requires extensive skills, tactics, modes and various other factors to make it balanced (like the concept of pain in Berserk). Otherwise it would be a bit boring (just bounce the enemies till one of you die).
Well, as you see in Berserk, I have a few tricks for melee -- and there are a lot more from where it came for. The same goes for the Force...
I think I'm gonna send you PM.
I'll reply to it as soon as possible -- I'm quite busy with the christmas-rush now O.o.
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you are Tatooine native in remote village on travel for resources to Mos Eisley. You meet old hermit in odd circumstances and find yourself involved in strange activities. You help with some cargo on a ship that carries some bothans. On return journey ,which seems more like escape, they are anxious to deliver some plans to somewhere and you are the person that might help. You are to meet some representative and pass the thing to some kind of diplomatic official on corellian corvette class ship coming at Tatooine orbit in the following days...
For those who are not so familiar with SW, that Old Hermit would be Obi-Wan Kenobi, bothans on the ship are the ones who stole Death Star plans, diplomatic official is Leia Organa.
What could happen next is: Obi-Wan mentioned The Force and Jedi Knights and somehow captivated your attention. After passing plans you come back to your village, but after short period of time you must know something more about that Force old man mentioned. You travel to his hut only to discover that he is missing. The only thing you can find is word carved on the floor: Alderan. Soon you discover a lot of rush going in towns and Imperial Troops around. You decide to follow the clue and travel to Alderan to find Ben Kenobi. The only ship you think of that could take you there is the one you helped with cargo and bothans. They agree to help you. So you travel to Alderan. The ship comes out of hyperspace in asteroid field, and after quick escape is in close proximity with strange moon. It reveals to be space station. Unfortunately, your ship is recognized (from first cargo run) and captured into tractor beam to take on board of Death Star. You and others are taken into custody and you are put into prison cell. While waiting for interrogation you hear blaster shots somewhere away and door to your cell suddenly becomes unlocked. You got out, find some dead stormtroopers, get blaster rifle, and sneak around to get to your ship. It is dangerous and long journey. To your amazement at some point you meet.. Obi-Wan Kenobi. He said he has no time to explain now, that you should get to your ship, and that tactor beams will be off soon so you can escape. You finaly get to the ship, and after tractor beam are actually off you got away...
This could go like this all the way, for example, at some point there is cut-scene and you see Obi-Wan and Yoda and some blonde boy in starfighter taking off. Obi-Wan says "this boy is our last hope", Yoda answers "no, there is another..". The cut-scene is followed by you having the dream of strange jungle-like planet and hearing words 'Force, Dagobah, Yoda'..
So how your force training could start (so you don't need Jedi Academy era to use the force)
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Darth Vader looks at you. Darth Vader clenches his hand in a fist! You're choking! You're choking! You're choking! You're choking! You die...
Darth Vader says "I am your father!". You are stunned and miserable! You are stunned and miserable! You are stunned and miserable! Darth Vader takes you over to the dark side. You win!
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Knights of the Old RepubLic:
Choose target... Target: Darth Malak (lightly wounded) [m]ore... You use Force Storm on Darth Malak! Darth Malak is hit! Darth Malak is hit! Darth Malak is critically hit! Darth Malak is hit! Darth Malak misses you. You critically hit Darth Malak with your Lightsaber (2d8+6)! You critically hit Darth Malak with your Short Lightsaber (2d6+5)! Darth Malak dies. Congratulations! You defeated Darth Malak!
In all honesty, StarWarsRL would work if based on the Knights of the Old Republic era (or at least uses the Soldier/Scoundrel/Scout/Jedi Guardian/Jedi Sentinel/Jedi Consular class system).
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How could they misspell Darth Malek... those LA games are getting worse and worse -_-
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Heh. I don't even like StarWars that much, but that screenshot makes me want to play that game SO HARD.
What I think would be neat is if you started out as the galactic scruffy rogue/mercenery type of guy and about 2/3 of the game was played that way. Then, you have some sort of goal or mission you complete and you have the option of retiring on your ill-gained spoils, or joining the jedi academy and completing another 1/3 (much more difficult) endgame where you slowly gain in jedi rank and either go save the galaxy or convert to the dark side and destroy it :)
Also it should have some fast and simple ship-to-ship combat. And those robot stormtroopers from the first Dark Forces game. Those guys were awesome.
All this is purely hypothetical of course. I just liked the game idea and felt like riffing on it.
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Heh. I don't even like StarWars that much, but that screenshot makes me want to play that game SO HARD.
May I tease you some more then? :D
This time - space battle!
| X-Wing Red 3
| Red Group: 4 of 4 fighters
| front shields:
| ************-----------45/99
H | hull integrity:
| ******************-----68/99
H - X | rear shields:
H H | ***********************99/99
H \ | blasters(4): linked(x4)
\ \ X | torpedos(6): single(x1)
\ X |
| damage report:
X Y | EJECT _ LAUNCH **.
| | / \ | LASERS **.
A B | Y | | Y ENGINE **.
B \ | | | | | SHIELD ***
\ | | =|A|= | ASTROM ***
C=O=E | U__/U o U\__U SENSOR LSE
| U___U___U___U THRSTR power
| U U mangmt
ighter Alpha 4 explodes! X-Wing Red 2 fires its blaster cannons. X-Wing Red 2
misses! X-Wing Red 4 fires its blaster cannons. You set shield recharge to full
. TIE Fighter Alpha 1 fires its laser cannons. TIE Fighter Alpha 1 hits you!
Your sensors are damaged. Your astromech droid starts repairing sensors.
Torpedo hits Corellian Corvette Korneelia VII. Hull condition critical!!!
Too bad it will never happen...
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That screenshot looks very cool indeed. I hope it inspires someone!
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In all honesty, StarWarsRL would work if based on the Knights of the Old Republic era (or at least uses the Soldier/Scoundrel/Scout/Jedi Guardian/Jedi Sentinel/Jedi Consular class system).
And why's that ? Yeah, it would work, but work in different way than in Rebellion era.
Soldier/Scoundrel/Scout could work easy in that era, jedi class could be available later in game. And game could be story oriented with roguelike fights at locations like bases, cities, villages, caves, on board ships, space stations, etc. With worldmap maybe and ship (space travel, planets.. also combat?). Lots of quests and side story lines etc. Big game but *worth* effort.
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/me hated DnD.
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/me hated DnD.
I think people liked it..
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Rebellion era would be the best choice imo.