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211
Requests For Features / Re: A Much Simpler Request Than the Last One
« on: September 26, 2007, 23:53 »
So, blaze the trail, I say. This is basically the logical extension of a crit system anyway. Having a level at which your damage increases dramatically is, I think, an amount of inconsistency which is rather uncharacteristic of the cinematic-style "big cone of hurt" shotgun.
212
Requests For Features / A Much Simpler Request Than the Last One
« on: September 26, 2007, 21:55 »
Instead of damage being random, make it affected by how well you score on your to-hit roll. This way Eagle Eye can do something for shotguns without screwing around with the numbers directly. A really awful "miss," for a shotgun, would deal minimum damage regardless of distance, while a really solid hit will deal the max even if you're far away.
PS: I don't think this should be just for shotguns, either. It seems basically appropriate for any of the non-explosive weapons. Higher roll = better hit. If done correctly, this should leave the average damage of a chaingun or plasma rifle basically unchanged: there may be a very small bias towards higher damage, but the biggest factor is still that some shots which wouldn't hit now do. Those will generally be at the lower end of the range, so it balances out.
PS: I don't think this should be just for shotguns, either. It seems basically appropriate for any of the non-explosive weapons. Higher roll = better hit. If done correctly, this should leave the average damage of a chaingun or plasma rifle basically unchanged: there may be a very small bias towards higher damage, but the biggest factor is still that some shots which wouldn't hit now do. Those will generally be at the lower end of the range, so it balances out.
213
Requests For Features / Re: Weapon/Trait Overhaul
« on: September 26, 2007, 12:22 »
I'm still not keen on the idea of splitting up the melee tree like that. Like I said, the main thing I want out of ninja is dual-wielding, and I think you should be able to use that with Berserker. If you have to replace the stealth with something else to preserve flavor and/or balance, then that's the better option.
215
Requests For Features / Re: Weapon/Trait Overhaul
« on: September 26, 2007, 02:05 »But 25% is on the other end of the scale, being almost as powerful as three old Hellrunners. 15% would be much better.Yeah, that doesn't sound too bad. I think I can agree with that.
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I realized what you were doing there, but what I meant is that you now get to wield two guns on level five, as compared on level three like before. Plus you won't get that nice gun damage before it anymore, although you'll get some accuracy.I can see how not having the extra damage might be troublesome, but there's one thing you're not taking into account: I never said that these things required two levels of their prereq to be unlocked. I know that's pretty much the standard number right now, but I actually envisioned this as the first level of most or all of these unlocking the next level of the tree. I guess I should've said that before. @_@
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Halving the enemy sight range is way too much. At max, it should be reduced by 3 or something. And again, it should be uncompatible with Berserker and the other way around, if only because I can't see an insane bloodthirsty marine creeping around on his toes like some cowardly wuss.Think less viking and more Rambo. The guy who sneaks can still bust a guy down to his component materials when he gets up close and personal.
216
AliensRL / Re: This Game is TOO HARD
« on: September 26, 2007, 01:05 »
Well, I thought it was pretty strange to make them more than one tile. The fact that they are is why I assumed there was a reason they don't look like regular old stairs.
217
AliensRL / Re: This Game is TOO HARD
« on: September 26, 2007, 00:56 »
What's wrong with the old standbys > and <? I mean, I haven't played that far, so I guess there's a good reason, but I don't know it.
218
Requests For Features / Re: Weapon/Trait Overhaul
« on: September 26, 2007, 00:30 »
The new Hellrunner: really? The one we already have always seemed kind of underpowered to me. I mean, it's not terrible, but it's this little incremental chip that just does not at all stand equal to any of the bigger bonuses.
Intuition: It is kind of a big move, but there were several reasons for it. For one thing, I can see melee or splash characters dipping into it for the lever sense. That's an important enough ability that I think you should be able to do that without taking two ranks of "I'm a cripple but I can see real good" first. I don't think that getting Int3 a little earlier will really break things that much. It'll take some of the pressure off the levels close to The Wall, but considering that's all you've got by that point (i.e. no EE) it's not that big of a boost anymore.
Gun Kata: I think you may have misunderstood what I was going for there. Dualgunner and SoaG are not prereqs for Gun Kata. Gun Kata takes the place of both of them by combining their effects. With that, as well as the move-fire and move-reload, you really shouldn't need any mods to finish AoM. Besides that, removing mods isn't really necessary to this plan, it just seems like a simple way to both balance things and make trait/weapon interaction a little more manageable. If people still want them in there, you can just rebalance by making the monsters tougher. It's not hard.
Ninja: No, you're not supposed to sneak around in Doom, but you also aren't supposed to try to get in the Cyberdemon's face without IDDQD. It still might be better to put in something different, though. If you've got any ideas for what to do with that one, since I really don't think dual-wielding is enough by itself, cough 'em up.
Intuition: It is kind of a big move, but there were several reasons for it. For one thing, I can see melee or splash characters dipping into it for the lever sense. That's an important enough ability that I think you should be able to do that without taking two ranks of "I'm a cripple but I can see real good" first. I don't think that getting Int3 a little earlier will really break things that much. It'll take some of the pressure off the levels close to The Wall, but considering that's all you've got by that point (i.e. no EE) it's not that big of a boost anymore.
Gun Kata: I think you may have misunderstood what I was going for there. Dualgunner and SoaG are not prereqs for Gun Kata. Gun Kata takes the place of both of them by combining their effects. With that, as well as the move-fire and move-reload, you really shouldn't need any mods to finish AoM. Besides that, removing mods isn't really necessary to this plan, it just seems like a simple way to both balance things and make trait/weapon interaction a little more manageable. If people still want them in there, you can just rebalance by making the monsters tougher. It's not hard.
Ninja: No, you're not supposed to sneak around in Doom, but you also aren't supposed to try to get in the Cyberdemon's face without IDDQD. It still might be better to put in something different, though. If you've got any ideas for what to do with that one, since I really don't think dual-wielding is enough by itself, cough 'em up.
219
AliensRL / Re: This Game is TOO HARD
« on: September 25, 2007, 18:37 »
Update: The problem was that I thought the lifts were pools of water. -_-
220
AliensRL / This Game is TOO HARD
« on: September 25, 2007, 16:55 »
What is with you people posting "screenshots" of levels above 1 and weapons other than the pistol, MP5, magnum, and shotgun? You're obviously lying. Come on now. Own up.
That's a joke, but for serious AliensRL is too hard. How are you people doing this? I can wander around the whole damn complex forever and ever and ever until I either just get bored to death or my ammo runs out, but I have never seen a lift anywhere. What's the deal?
That's a joke, but for serious AliensRL is too hard. How are you people doing this? I can wander around the whole damn complex forever and ever and ever until I either just get bored to death or my ammo runs out, but I have never seen a lift anywhere. What's the deal?
221
Requests For Features / Weapon/Trait Overhaul
« on: September 25, 2007, 15:50 »
Hi. I'm new to the forum, but there's a snowball's chance in hell Kornel remembers my name because I emailed him like... a friggin' year ago with some suggestions. (Seriously, it was before the challenges or the player info or the trait prereqs. Old.) He told me to post them here, but I never got around to it. I figure this time I should do it right in the first place.
The new DoomRL is definitely sweet, very obviously an improvement over last time I played with it. (Though it seems much harder now. >_<) There are some things that I think need a bit more work though, primarily with traits. First though, a little weapons gripe: I hated the shotgun then, and I hate it now. Aside from the fact that it's kind of silly to have a weapon that's useless by level two unless you roll very poorly, it just seems weird to have three versions of it. Now, I sort of understand why it's like that, because it's supposed to parallel the progression of the other weapons. The trouble is that it's not really any good, it's not different enough from the other shotguns to be any fun (especially if you get Shottyman, then you basically carry around four fewer shells) and to top it all off, the progression for precision and splash weaponry is made uneven. P->C->PR, SG->CS->DS->RL->BFG. See what I mean? I think there should be another step in the precision weapons line. I suggest a plasma pistol, since you start getting plasma ammo well before you can actually use it, particularly if you take the red stairs. I like either 4d3 or 1d10, not sure which winds up giving the better balance.
That brings up another problem, that the split between the two classes of weaponry makes you do weird things with traits. Now most of the traits are decent enough, but the big bonuses of the specialist traits like Shottyman or Intuition just make the incremental bonuses of the other traits seem flat. Finesse, Ironman, Hellrunner, and Son of a Bitch basically exist to give you more time to find out whether or not you're going to pick up a double shotgun before it's time to run down EE->Int with your chaingun. This is made even worse by the fact that there are some traits you just don't touch outside of challenges; Son of a Gun is just no replacement for EE->Int unless you need Dualgunner to get through AoM, and I don't even need to mention the melee stuff.
The best fix for this is to restructure the traits with this specialization scheme in mind from the beginning. Have general traits unlock options for improvement with melee, precision, or splash, and those options in turn unlock further improvements for specific weapon classes. It seems inevitable to me that this come with some degree of power creep, since some of the options as they currently exist are subpar anyway. If it's that big a deal, just buff the monsters. :p
Intuition1 (as is) unlocks precision tree
Eagle Eye (combine with Cateye, cap 2 or 3) unlocks pistol and auto branches
Gun Kata (Dualgunner + SoaG, cap 2, first level gives move-fire,2 second level gives move-reload on empty mag)
Bullet Hose (shots per action for CG/PR increased to 10, mags doubled)
Son of a Bitch (die type and knockback +1, cap 2) unlocks splash tree
Reloader (reload time halved, cap 2) unlocks shotgun and explosive branches
Shottyman (number of dice +1, move reload, cap 1)
Demoman (explosion radius and number of dice +1, cap 1 or 2)
Hellrunner (speed/dodge +25%, cap 3) unlocks melee tree3
Tough as Nails (armor +1, health +10, cap 3) unlocks damage and stealth branches
Berserker (combine with Brute, cap 3)
Ninja (monster sight radius halved, gain extra attack from prepared slot, cap 1)
This all probably seems a bit overpowered, but I think that's curable in a rather simple fashion: get rid of weapon mods, which are already kind of annoying to use anyway. You either get your target weapon early enough to spec in it or you don't. Even if it does have some power creep, it is at least much more balanced than the current model, which I think is the most important part.
NOTES
1Why is Intuition before Eagle Eye? Because EE is useless to shotgunners, and not really of interest to demoguys either. The general idea with this tree structure was to place the generalist traits at the root.
2Yeah, that's right, move-fire. Basically with every step, your character asks for a target whenever one is in sight. Might seem like a bit much, but remember that you're restricted to a pair of pistols, here.
3The entire melee tree is a huge buff. That's okay as far as I'm concerned. The AoB challenge is damn near unplayable in its current form. I've never survived long enough to get to the Chained Court! :(
The new DoomRL is definitely sweet, very obviously an improvement over last time I played with it. (Though it seems much harder now. >_<) There are some things that I think need a bit more work though, primarily with traits. First though, a little weapons gripe: I hated the shotgun then, and I hate it now. Aside from the fact that it's kind of silly to have a weapon that's useless by level two unless you roll very poorly, it just seems weird to have three versions of it. Now, I sort of understand why it's like that, because it's supposed to parallel the progression of the other weapons. The trouble is that it's not really any good, it's not different enough from the other shotguns to be any fun (especially if you get Shottyman, then you basically carry around four fewer shells) and to top it all off, the progression for precision and splash weaponry is made uneven. P->C->PR, SG->CS->DS->RL->BFG. See what I mean? I think there should be another step in the precision weapons line. I suggest a plasma pistol, since you start getting plasma ammo well before you can actually use it, particularly if you take the red stairs. I like either 4d3 or 1d10, not sure which winds up giving the better balance.
That brings up another problem, that the split between the two classes of weaponry makes you do weird things with traits. Now most of the traits are decent enough, but the big bonuses of the specialist traits like Shottyman or Intuition just make the incremental bonuses of the other traits seem flat. Finesse, Ironman, Hellrunner, and Son of a Bitch basically exist to give you more time to find out whether or not you're going to pick up a double shotgun before it's time to run down EE->Int with your chaingun. This is made even worse by the fact that there are some traits you just don't touch outside of challenges; Son of a Gun is just no replacement for EE->Int unless you need Dualgunner to get through AoM, and I don't even need to mention the melee stuff.
The best fix for this is to restructure the traits with this specialization scheme in mind from the beginning. Have general traits unlock options for improvement with melee, precision, or splash, and those options in turn unlock further improvements for specific weapon classes. It seems inevitable to me that this come with some degree of power creep, since some of the options as they currently exist are subpar anyway. If it's that big a deal, just buff the monsters. :p
Intuition1 (as is) unlocks precision tree
Eagle Eye (combine with Cateye, cap 2 or 3) unlocks pistol and auto branches
Gun Kata (Dualgunner + SoaG, cap 2, first level gives move-fire,2 second level gives move-reload on empty mag)
Bullet Hose (shots per action for CG/PR increased to 10, mags doubled)
Son of a Bitch (die type and knockback +1, cap 2) unlocks splash tree
Reloader (reload time halved, cap 2) unlocks shotgun and explosive branches
Shottyman (number of dice +1, move reload, cap 1)
Demoman (explosion radius and number of dice +1, cap 1 or 2)
Hellrunner (speed/dodge +25%, cap 3) unlocks melee tree3
Tough as Nails (armor +1, health +10, cap 3) unlocks damage and stealth branches
Berserker (combine with Brute, cap 3)
Ninja (monster sight radius halved, gain extra attack from prepared slot, cap 1)
This all probably seems a bit overpowered, but I think that's curable in a rather simple fashion: get rid of weapon mods, which are already kind of annoying to use anyway. You either get your target weapon early enough to spec in it or you don't. Even if it does have some power creep, it is at least much more balanced than the current model, which I think is the most important part.
NOTES
1Why is Intuition before Eagle Eye? Because EE is useless to shotgunners, and not really of interest to demoguys either. The general idea with this tree structure was to place the generalist traits at the root.
2Yeah, that's right, move-fire. Basically with every step, your character asks for a target whenever one is in sight. Might seem like a bit much, but remember that you're restricted to a pair of pistols, here.
3The entire melee tree is a huge buff. That's okay as far as I'm concerned. The AoB challenge is damn near unplayable in its current form. I've never survived long enough to get to the Chained Court! :(