Chaosforge Forum

DoomRL => Requests For Features => Topic started by: 2birds1stone on January 06, 2016, 06:47

Title: Survivalist buff idea
Post by: 2birds1stone on January 06, 2016, 06:47
I think Survivalist is generally acknowledged as being pretty underwhelming, so I figured I'd suggest: instead of having a 50% shot at reducing 1 damage to 0, maybe it could just remove the 1 damage floor against your character, so that resistances and armour can reduce any given attack to 0?

If almost doubling its effectiveness is too unreasonable, you can remove the health pack overheal from the trait.
Title: Re: Survivalist buff idea
Post by: Tormuse on January 08, 2016, 17:01
I think that, even with removing the health pack overheal, being able to consistently reduce attacks to zero would be unreasonable, because with the right armour, you could make your character invulnerable.  That's potentially game-breaking and more than doubling its effectiveness.
Title: Re: Survivalist buff idea
Post by: 2birds1stone on January 08, 2016, 21:19
Uh, this is almost exactly doubling? Survivalist currently has a 50% chance of reducing one-damage attacks to zero, this is almost-but-not-quite 100% of one-damage attacks (it'd ignore attacks that would deal one damage even in the absence of the damage floor, but I suspect them to be the minority of attacks).

It's also pretty clear given the state of other master traits (mainly looking at Vampyre) that some level of brokenness is seen as acceptable, but sure, I agree that it would be extremely strong.

How consistently could you realistically do this? TaN(3) + Red Armour is 7 protection, which means Mancubi still deal 4 damage on average even taking into account resistances. The main problem I see is that it'd now be possible to wall out Arachnotrons with Red Armour, which kinda undoes their role in preventing players from putting all their eggs in that basket.
Title: Re: Survivalist buff idea
Post by: Evilpotatoe on January 12, 2016, 03:46
Buffing to 75% chances of getting 0 damages would be doubling efficency.  (chances of losing 1hp divided by 2), but here, you completely remove this chance, which can't be expressed in term of %

Anyway, I personally think this trait is quite useless, and was surprised to notice this 50% thing nerf when I used it, since good players tend to never get hit.  I guess it must have been added after some "abuses" with P-modded red + TaN or things like that, which probably made characters invulnerable too easily.
The only run in which I used survivalist was... an AoHu run. I tanked with a freaking AoHu, even through the mortuary ! It was ridiculous, and made the trait fun... for once.  But this trait blocks SoB, so... still "worst trait ever" for me :p

And about your idea, well... I wouldn't argue against a buff, btw, but the overheal is more interesting than the ability to become 100% invulnerable, and nerfing that looks like a bad balance choice