Chaosforge Forum

DoomRL => Discussion => Topic started by: Turgor on December 13, 2005, 22:12

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Turgor on December 13, 2005, 22:12

I lost count of the amount of melee games i've played now.. probably close to 50. One thing i've noticed is the very low hit ratio you have when using your fists or a knife (haven't gotten to the chainsaw this way yet :S). Even when you use aggressive tactics, you'll miss around 50%, where you'd miss only around 20% with weapons like the pistol and the chaingun.
So if the to hit on melee combat is increased you'll be able to kill enemies faster that way.

Another thing that i think will work well is cutting the amount of turns it costs to do a melee attack in half, for both the player and the enemies. This will make melee enemies a slightly bigger threat, but not that much. It will allow you to get into a fistfight with a former human without that imp shooting a fireball at you every single hit you land (or miss).

Stunning with the chainsaw was suggested elsewhere, but i'd like to add stunning with your fists too, except at a much lower probability than chainsaw stunning.

I know that part of the charm of DoomRL is its accent on missile weapons, but i seriously dislike the fact that melee combat is just equal to suicide right now, and i'd hate to see melee disappearing.


edit: maybe adding a new trait would help too:
boxing: +2 to hit and +2 dodge when using melee

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on December 14, 2005, 18:17

Quoting: Turgor

robably close to 50. One thing i've noticed is the very low hit ratio you have when using your fists or a knife (haven't gotten to the chainsaw this way yet :S).

Valid point. I'll take a look at that :/. Maybe make Brute increase ToHit as well as damage?

Quoting: Turgor

Another thing that i think will work well is cutting the amount of turns it costs to do a melee attack in half, for both the player and the enemies.

That's a good idea. At least for the knife and fists.

I'll try to beefup melee for 0.9.9.

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Turgor on December 14, 2005, 20:47

Quoting: Kornel Kisielewicz

Maybe make Brute increase ToHit as well as damage?

yeah that would work well too. But maybe the bonus shouldn't be +4 for every level in that case.. You don't want to make it too easy ;)

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Obscillesk on December 14, 2005, 21:07

heheheh I see a day where all YAVP's are lvl 3 brute, tough as nails and a coupla ironmans :)


which reminds me, Cyberdemon should have some badass melee if you actually manage to close range with him :)

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on December 14, 2005, 21:07

As long as it is clear that shooting is more effective, I can make it easier ;-).

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Thomas on December 15, 2005, 00:09

Maybe you could make melee weapons just as good as ranged ones so that we could say "Will I do a melee game? Or a ranged one?" as if a melee game wouldn't be a joke, or a challenge to see who could get the furthest.

If melee did more damage then you could run up to an enemy with a chainsaw, do a cartoon style-vertical-slice-and-run-as-they-split-in-half and watch them take 6d6 damage (2d6 more than the dblshotgun)

"I'm on lower heatlh, but it was worth the 2d6 extra damage!"

And in the halls of carnage:

"Hmmm... BFG... or uber-chainsaw-ov-dewm? 8d8, or 8d10?"

Or that could just be a challenge mode.

Angel of melee:

Melee weapons gain +50% damage. Guns lose 50% damage.

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Kornel Kisielewicz on December 15, 2005, 03:54

Quoting: Thomas

Angel of melee:
Melee weapons gain +50% damage. Guns lose 50% damage.

I really like this one :-D.

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Thomas on December 15, 2005, 07:12

Thanks (grin bigger than face)

I also put it in the challenge mode forum.

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: Turgor on December 16, 2005, 16:18

Quoting: Turgor

Even when you use aggressive tactics, you'll miss around 50%, where you'd miss only around 20% with weapons like the pistol and the chaingun.

i think that this statement of me was mainly out of frustration.. i've tested it again, and especially against former humans and sergeants the hit ratio is actually about the same as with the gun. Against demons and imps it is somewhat lower though, but not as low as i stated above.. so sorry about that 0.o

this doesn't mean that i don't think an even better hit ratio would benefit melee combat (like making brute increase to hit as well)

Title: Suggestions to make melee more usefull
Post by: JimmyJ on December 17, 2005, 00:43

Maybe a trait: Fists of fury !! Your fists have a knockback rate!