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[Titt]

I was surprised, while playing Ao100 in 0.9.8.10, to find that after reaching character level 19, my experience readout seemed stuck at 19/0%, and I was then more surprised to find it eventually change, to 19/1% and then 19/2%. I only noticed it changing immediately after nuking levels, though.

Is it the case that experience is supposed to stop growing at character level 19, and there's a bug which allows you to gain more experience anyway by nuking levels? Or is this an intentional thing? Or is it the case that experience continues growing, but only very very slowly, so that it's possible (but very difficult) to reach level 20?

[Blade]

I haven't nuked any level during playing and at level 100 i had 19/4%. Exp is growing after level 19, and growing at the same rate as before, but requirement for level 20 is so damn huge that it's nearly impossible to reach it even in Ao100.

[Titt]

Thanks for the information. Has anyone ever made it to character level 20?

[Blade]

There is no chance to get so much exp even in Ao100. Spawning levers gives not enough exp, and ressurected monsters don't give it at all. And, imho the main reason: noone tried it because the reward doesn't worth it. Noone have so much time that they can waste so stupidly.)

[Kornel Kisielewicz]

Umm, to be honest, the game would probably crash once you reached l20 :P

[Cyber Killer]

IMHO levels in rpg are stupid - the point of a roleplaying game isn't just to get your character leveled up so much that there isn't anyone more powerfull in the whole universe :-P. Well I guess that's just the curse of D&D cast upon cRPG's ;-P. (in most pen & paper RPG's there are no such things as character levels)

[Upaut]

(in most pen & paper RPG's there are no such things as character levels)

Really?  Which tabletop RPGs were you playing?  I mean, I could swear every D&D (yes, I'm including v1, despite only playing v2 and up) had character levels.  Shadowrun, Vampire the Masquerade, and White Wolf had character levels as well.  I would name off more, but I think my point is made...

[FantomFang]

First post in this forum! So before I respond to the post, I'd just like to say, Great game, Kornel.

On the topic of levels in RPG's, they are not strictly needed, but every game has some sort of leveling process. Whether it is D&D, or Cyberpunk 2020 (no levels, only skill points earnings) Really, the point of an RPG is to have some sort of leveling system, or else it isn't an RPG, it is simply a roleplay. Whether or not those levels have a major impact on the game is another beast entirely (Cyberpunk 2020 vs. D&D, no matter how much you 'level' in Cyberpunk, which means increasing your skills, you are still easily killable. D&D is the opposite).

Honestly, I would have to say more RPG's do have levels. As long as the system is balanced, even god-like powers aren't bad. Anyways, you can just choose what you prefer.

One last thing, if you think leveling systems in RPG's are bad, how would you propose changing it? Besides, it seems to me the leveling system in DoomRL isn't strictly a leveling system. Its just a good way to fill in the process of how your Doomguy picks up tricks and tactics as the game goes on, instead of getting simply "stronger".

Meh, sorry if i rambled a little bit off that, I just hate leaving thoughts incomplete =)
Great game again Kornel!

[Cyber Killer]

rpgs without levels: (to name a few) Paranoia, Fading Suns, all Tri-Stat dX based games, Call of Cthulhu, all Savage Worlds based games, Neuroshima (very popular game in Poland)... - there are skill points, but no character levels

it would be easier to say that nearly only D&D/d20 based games have character levels, but...

there is more to RPG than D&D :-)

[zaimoni]

rpgs without levels: (to name a few) Paranoia, Fading Suns, all Tri-Stat dX based games, Call of Cthulhu, all Savage Worlds based games, Neuroshima (very popular game in Poland)... - there are skill points, but no character levels

Yes.

it would be easier to say that nearly only D&D/d20 based games have character levels, but...

Back when I was actively collecting rules sets (admittedly before d20; I dropped out of that ~1998), maybe 75% of games had explicit leveling.  The proportion of levelless games went up by publication date.

there is more to RPG than D&D :-)

Yes.

[jake250]

Really, the point of an RPG is to have some sort of leveling system, or else it isn't an RPG, it is simply a roleplay.

I personally hate people that gives such claims. A RPG is a ROLE PLAYING GAME and there is absolutely nothing in its naming that indicates in any way a requirement for levels. Plus, you don't even need levels to give a sense of advancement.

[Blade]

Imho levels are an objective way to show toughness of player to other players. You need just to say: I'm 35-th level now", instead of saying: "I have maxed my skill of short swords fighting, running, my shield skill is 86, and i have 378 magic points". It's plain shorter way to show your superiority.

[Chamber]

A level-less RPG - a noble sentiment.

At least in Doom, advancement comes both from getting new talents and picking up new weapons, so it feels natural. 

Now who wants to join me in my crusade to abolish hitpoints?  :)

[Dawgas]

Fuck you.

Hitpoints make this game SANE, imagine if you didn't have them

oh, and there should be more levels at least possible to achieve, even if you would never be able to reach them in a game (level 20, 21?)

[rekenne]

A) Don't be so quick to say "Fuck you" to people. Be civil.

B) It was clearly a joke.