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[Sambojin]

I've been playing a fair bit of the new version recently and I've noticed something. You are MEANT to nuke the Cyber-daemon. It's not random, it's not a maybe, it's a given. You have the items to do it every time as long as you do the special levels. And it seems that the levels to do it ALWAYS spawn.

Let me explain. Everyone knows how good the arena/chained court/the wall run is. You get some nifty weapons, a good melee weapon for berserkers, some very handy mods and a missile launcher/backpack. In fact, these three levels when all completed give you the weaponry and items that you have no excuse to not get to hell.

But now there's another run. It's the mortuary/unholy cathedral/lava pits run. In the mortuary you get a nuclear BFG and some angelic armour. In the unholy cathedral you get the longinus spear. In the lava pits you get the lava-element. Admittedly you can skip the cathedral if you're not a H2H character. This means that as long as you do the mortuary and the lava pits you ALWAYS have a nuke(overcharged nuclear BFG) and an invulnerability(lava-element) to nuke the cybie. ALWAYS.

Thus JC isn't just for that lucky "I got a white globe at level 24" kind of run. You are meant to kill him on every run if you can. There's no excuses any more. You've got the nuke, you've got the invulnerabilty, you've got some spiffy armour you won't need until JC and a good melee weapon if you want it. Nuke that cybie and kill some iDsoftware arse!

[Kamikaze14]

The nukes were always there.  Also, you forgot the Spider's Lair.

[Sambojin]

Yeah, I did. Still, it's just one more option I guess. I'm going to have to stop whimping out on the lava pits though. I've never actually seen the lava elemental fire at me. I'm assuming he does some kind of napalm launcher type damage. Does someone have some stats on him to update the wiki? Or is it still "wait until more people finish it"?

And does he only spawn in the southern section of the second island from the left or is it random? He's spawned there all the times I've killed him AFAIK.

[thelaptop]

Did someone say something about gunning for the Mortuary?

That is... usually not the greatest idea unless you have excessive firepower and know what you are doing.  Winning the normal way by killing Cybie isn't really that hard, it's just that now, full wins are a little less luck based.  You stilll need to factor in the restrictions from the various challenges and the mercy (or lack thereof) of the RNG for a truly successful run.

[Tuomari Jim]

So far I haven't been killed by the lava elemental (of the two times I went that far). He does hit like a ton of bricks, though, when he finally decides to shoot.

[UltimateChaos]

It makes Conqueror runs actually doable... instead of almost finishing them and then not funding a globe.  Iirc, the lava element doesn't last very long so you still need to finish off JC.

Also, let's see you play on N! (or UV) and take the completion of any of those special levels as a given >.>

[Rabiat]

So, am I getting this correctly:

For a full win, you need a nuke (to reveal the stairs to HF), invulnerability (to survive the blast) and the means to beat JC.

Stuff that can be used as a nuke: thermonuclear bomb, nuclear BFG, and Trigun.

The Spider's Lair has a guaranteed thermonuclear bomb, but the level itself isn't guaranteed. The Mortuary has a guaranteed nuclear BFG, and the level is guaranteed if you play on at least HNTR. The Trigun isn't guaranteed.

Stuff that makes you invulnerable: invulnerability globe, lava element.

Invulnerability globes aren't guaranteed. The lava element is guaranteed in the Lava Pits.

What you're saying is, a full win can be planned as long as you play on HNTR or up, visit the Lava Pits to get the lava element, visit the Mortuary to get the nuclear BFG, and survive to beat JC?

[Tavana]

That about sums it up. Now about that ultimate ending....

[Rabiat]

Now about that ultimate ending....

Is that the old bit where you switch to the Butcher's Cleaver, use a phase device, and pray for that 1/1368 chance to land in JC's gut?

[UltimateChaos]

No.  It's a special set of stairs that open up only if you have punched every demon in the game in the face with your fists.

[raekuul]

Kidding, right?

[thelaptop]

Kidding, right?

Dun dun DUNNNNN.

I think apart from a small handful of people who are de facto sworn to secrecy, what it really is is anyone's guess.

[Fanta Hege]

What I've gathered the ultimate ending is basicly wearing DS and the berserk armor at the same time and something should happen

Unfortunantly finding thise two uniques at the same time is near impossible and the DS using recruitment was changed so its just speculation after speculation after speculation.

[Kashi]

What I've gathered the ultimate ending is basicly wearing DS and the berserk armor at the same time and something should happen

Unfortunantly finding thise two uniques at the same time is near impossible and the DS using recruitment was changed so its just speculation after speculation after speculation.

Now, tell me that Femto appears in the game and I'll be trying like a f***ing moron to find the DS and the Berserker Armor.

[Nameless]

1st theory: the two uniques are programmed to never spawn in the same game, and the ultimate ending is a practical joke to keep more people playing DoomRL.

2nd theory: the ultimate ending automatically occurs when you earn the very last badge, and it consists of the Cyberdemon's mother telling you off and changing your desktop background to a giant M for a jump scare.