DRL > Requests For Features

Request for Comments : Armor weight

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Zeb:

--- Quote from: Conker on December 29, 2007, 16:28 ---
--- Quote from: DaEezT on December 29, 2007, 15:37 ---It doesn't matter how much it impacts movement speed. Just having something like that at all feels WRONG.

Look at me, I'm carrying 500 kg of shells and 10mm rounds and 3 spare sets of armor but should I ever wear just one of those 3 armors I carry in my backpack I'll be slowed down.......

Let's cut the heroic marine some slack and let him walk unencumbered into the halls of Hell.

--- End quote ---

Personally, I think it's good to embrace change every once in a while. After all, you mention ADOM - that used to be just a single dungeon. If someone had said 'What, add a wilderness? No, that = Daggerfall, not ADOM. It feels WRONG' then it wouldn't have been half the game it is today (well, if Thomas Biskup had listened).

Obviously, there are caveats, but we shouldn't reject change purely because it's change and it frightens us - we should have more logical grounds. Otherwise we'll end up with 'No unique weapons, this != Nethack', 'No Unique Monsters, this != Angband', etc etc. It's a bad road to start down. There's no reason not to utilise good ideas just because they're present in other games.

The main problem I can think of is that a lot of situations where you're in trouble are ones where armour just won't help - a minimum of one damage is always done, and the game only allots 50 HP initially. So even if armour reduces all damage to 1, if you get surrounded by three or so Arachnotrons who are hitting with any frequency, you'll still be dead in a couple of rounds.

My point being that armour just isn't that big a part of the game right now. Perhaps if the HP were doubled (and subsequently attack strengths doubled as well), and armour therefore became more important, it'd be worth it. But as it is now, it seems like substantial work for minimal gain.

--- End quote ---

The thing is, ADoM is a slow-paced, serious Roguelike. Anything adding more depth to the game is usually good in that case (As long as it isn't silly or detract from the gameplay experience.) This is a fast-paced, coffee-table roguelike. Adding too much "real" stuff to it for no real reason detracts from the gameplay experience IMO. I have to agree with the majority on this one, this is really something that should be saved for when Kornel releases one of his "serious" roguelikes.

Kornel Kisielewicz:
The whole poin is that I have two paths right now. I can either crawl to a DoomRL closing now, leaving it's complexity as it is, or I can introduce new stats. It's the question of wether DoomRL should be developed further or left as it is... you wouldn't like to see it's development stop, would you?

Armor weight in a reduced way (movement speed only -5/-10/-20) will be available in 0.9.8.9 -- if people won't like it I'll remove it for 0.9.9.

Blade:
Theoretically - i didn't liked this idea much before playing.

Practically - I have played Beta and it seems to be ok. From my feelings armor don't affect speed so much that it would be real problem(at least blue armor). And also ability to see your current speed values is really cool.

Kornel, one question: do armor affects speed of monsters?

Aerton:
That is not an easy suggestion to make..
Being fast and non over-complex was a definitive feature of DRL, it made it a good game, it made it popular.
The scope of proposals implies change of the original vision. DRL is not a kind of game in where you spend time planning far ahead before taking any turn, it is played fast and aggressive. If you want it to become something different now, I think it's better to stop. You know you can not (and I think, do not want) to work on it forever. You have to stop somewhere and it's better to do it at the peak.
I would rather see a brand new game appear on chaosforge, rather than see DRL mutating out of its shape.

Malek Deneith:
The problem I see with armor weights the way I see it after some testing and rethinking is that it works in an way I think isn't what was intended. It was supposed to make wearing or not wearing heavy armor a tactical decision. The reality is that in most gunfights player is stationary anyways, so the only ones that get hurt by this decision are:
-people who use shottyman/combat shotgun
-people who play melee games (melee people need armor to get alive to the enemy)
-people who open doors and get several shots/fireballs in their face (as discussed recently)
-people who are badly wounded and need to retreat (in this cease armor they were wearing most likely is already giving 0 protection so it becomes a double dead weight)

And before anyone starts, no chaigning sped penalty to evasion penalty again won't help - the accuracy recently seems a bit high anyway.

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