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[Malek Deneith]

With 0.9.9.1 there will come "sandbox" or ability to edit a single level. Modding version alpha so to say ;) Since I've spent some time today working on example of what can be done with it Kornel asked me to do a replay of the final product (yes, replays are coming back too) and post it here. So there you go - unpack and run replay.bat, space to start the show (the replay seemed a bit slow but maby it's just me). For the donators there is a "playable" version of what I did here for download in beta topic.

[leonresevil2]

The replay was slow, and the enforcer bits were slightly agonizing. Maybe there is a way to play traveling missile frames at double speed compared to the rest of replays? Or record missiles every second frame? The level editing looks good nonetheless.

[Kornel Kisielewicz]

It's not Malek's fault. The Experimental version of the Recorder and Player stores no info on delays, and has a constant per-frame delay. The GMF player can't decide it on it's own, because it has no info what it's playing (could play anything).

[leonresevil2]

I was not blaming him, just wondered if information could be established on the delays, perhaps in the future? Or getting the replay to run more similar to the engine code of the game, so fast actions are fast and slow actions are slow? Just to get an outlook on the future of the replay system. It will be a neat feature, and I am just curious about how it may be evolved.

[Malek Deneith]

For those that might be interested, posting the example level I mentioned here. Nothing much, but shows few things that aren't obvious when looking just at sandbox arena. Also check wiki, add is doing a good job of compiling tutorials and data there.

PS. "Source" is a download for those who don't want to download Q2 sounds to go with this. If you *do* download the sound version remember to back-up your sound.ini before unzipping.

[leonresevil2]

I have probably a stupid question, but how do you run this "doomrl -sandbox sandbox/sandbox_arena.lua" it lists in the Wiki? I'm apparently no good at arguments, because I don't know where to enter them.

[Malek Deneith]

1) sandbox/sandbox_arena.lua part is the path to the level file, so you have to change that to match the file you wan't to run (i.e. in cease of my example level argument would be "doomrl -sandbox q2demo/q2demo.lua")

2) You can either create a shortcut to doomrl.exe, edit it properties and add "-sandbox <path to the lua file>" at the end of target field, or create a copy of doomrl.bat file and add parameters to that. The example I made is packaged with such a .bat file (might be missing in "source" package though, don't remember)

[leonresevil2]

Success! Thank you! So it literally starts the Arena? At least I know how to start it. I'll have to read up the info on the Wiki to figure coding out. But the bit about the argument wasn't on there. Thanks for the help.

[yaflhdztioxo]

Don't take this as a criticism but it is there.

http://doom.chaosforge.org/wiki/index.php?title=Sandbox

How to activate it

Run DoomRL with the -sandbox file argument. To load the default arena level, run:

doomrl -sandbox sandbox/sandbox_arena.lua

Is that not clear enough?  Does it need to be changed or moved?

[Kornel Kisielewicz]

add, not everyone has seen a console in his life ;).

Anyway, this is just because it is an experimental release -- later it will be accessible from the menu ingame.

[yaflhdztioxo]

Your post saddens me :(

The console is the most intuitive user interface imaginable.  Everyone should know it...

[thelaptop]

The console is the most intuitive user interface imaginable.  Everyone should know it...

YES.  See also this.

[leonresevil2]

The mention of the argument aspect was listed, but I (and probably a few other people in the world) was unfamiliar with how to run with an argument. I suppose I could have looked online for awhile to find out how to do it, but I had my question helpfully solved, and I appreciate that. Not saying that you are, but please don't criticize people for not being CLI users. People use computers in their own ways, and we don't always know everything about computers and programs.
My issue was not with the clarity of commands, but the question of how to implement and activate them. I simply didn't see how to run with an argument. Everyone else probably already knew, and thinks that I am a newb for asking, but I felt it was a reasonable issue to ask about.

[thelaptop]

I can understand how people might be unfamiliar with an interface that they have not seen before, but in this case, I will side with yaflhdztioxo.  Specific to this instance, the sandbox is highly experimental -- it's not even complete in the sense that it is still highly limitiing in terms of what it can and cannot do.

So using the sandbox is not important for normal playing and is meant for the more technically inclined who wish to experiment under the hood.

With that in mind, yaflhdztioxo's incredulity at how the instructions could not be followed is suitably justified -- if one is not used to using the "advanced" means of accessing software (CLI is older than GUI... how can that be advancement?), then it is likely that one is not going to be needing the sandbox any time soon.

Thus, I think it is unfair that yaflhdztioxo is being told to not criticise people for not being CLI users, because that is not the intention of yaflhdztioxo -- he is perturbed that a person who wants to experiment with an aspect of a tool that is non-essential to gameplay lacks the knowledge to access that aspect of the tool.

That's my two cents.

[leonresevil2]

You do have a good point. I would say "under the hood" is more appropriate than "advanced", but I understand the idea. Basically, yes, if a user is going to be using an experimental program aspect for the game, I suppose it's to be expected that the user understands the basics of programming and such. I, personally, am wanting to experiment with the sandbox to have fun and learn more about the game. I have had some experience in basic programming, but I did not understand about arguments. I was not saying that yaflhdztioxo was being critical, but I got the feeling that I was being looked down at for not knowing beforehand. Yes, I probably should've known such a thing, but I want to learn, and one of the first steps of learning is asking questions. It is up to those in charge of the wiki section, whether implementing the argument will be explained within, but my point was that we should be willing to help anyone interested in learning. The sandbox does not need to be built in to the menu yet, but anyone interested in experimenting with the sandbox should be able to get questions answered, ideally without being judged for not knowing.
Of course, that was probably not the case, and I sincerely apologize if I offended you in any way, yaflhdztioxo. The help listed was complete, I am probably just a special case for the question. I think I only felt minor judgment from misinterpreting text (it's hard to tell feelings from words sometimes).