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Author Topic: Invasion (0.9.9.1)  (Read 4139 times)

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Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« on: April 25, 2010, 10:21 »

My first mod. Based on INVU01 map from Invasion Unleashed 7.1. Kill hordes of spawning monsters.
Suggestions are wellcome)
« Last Edit: April 29, 2010, 12:56 by you »
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yaflhdztioxo

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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2010, 10:50 »

Skulltag!

I don't remember this map though.  Could you point to the wad?  I've played so many they all blur together :/
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2010, 10:57 »

yaflhdztioxo, invuled_beta71b_internal.wad
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2010, 11:08 »

I vaguely remember an underwater level.  I've played it before but I don't think I kept it.

Is it the one that would write down the author and their difficulty estimation in the lower left corner?  And which had a special lever that basically involved mashing levers to smash enemies?
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2010, 11:15 »

Is it the one that would write down the author and their difficulty estimation in the lower left corner?
Yep, exactly this one)
And which had a special lever that basically involved mashing levers to smash enemies?
Me not sure. Me played only 10-12 levels from it.
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Game Hunter

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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2010, 11:55 »

Pretty fun.  I haven't tried out a rapid-fire build yet, but with the lack of captains (or ANY cells) the only real option appears to be a shotgun build.  MAD didn't help all that much, though...you hit level 8 by the end of it all, so I think SM and then TaN/HR as necessary is pretty sufficient.  Also: minigun but no combat/double/super?  Plasma rifle is useless, RL COULD be if you get a few more rockets (too many cramped spaces to get much use though).  Double the 10mm ammo that foos drop and the chaingun/minigun can probably work.

I like the whole idea: huge wave of monsters  in each room before going to the next.  Are they supposed to spawn in the previous rooms as well?  I did notice (while backtracking) that a small room opened up near wave 2's area long after it had been completed but, other than that, it just made thing easier to keep yourself a safe distance from the big spawning spot and make your way through the level each time.  In fact, you may want to close previous doors just to make it a lot more frantic.  (If the level is done exactly as intended, just ignore this.)

Does the level have an end to it?  I killed everything I could find on wave 10 and nothing else has happened.
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2010, 21:25 »

version 1.1 uploaded. enjoy.
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Game Hunter

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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2010, 12:14 »

Truly, this is a more challenging version.  Though I haven't managed to reach wave 10 yet, I'll give you my thoughts on what I have seen so far:

- Colonels are kind of easy.  Since the double shotgun has an absolute cutoff at about six tiles, they can fire all day and never hit you (while you can snipe them with whatever weapon you use).  Placing them in the side rooms ala wave 3 might be the best solution, while using imps in the fourth wave; they're really good at killing themselves, I'll tell ya that.
- Captains would be hard if their to-hit was upped, but right now they're a joke.  In my experience with normal DoomRL, captains are difficult when you play on UV/N! and easy otherwise, which is a direct result of the +2 hit added at those difficulties.
- Giving the double shotgun so early is...wow.  Things die really fast.  Might wanna mix things up a little with the chaingun, then the claymore, THEN the double shotgun.
- It feels like Revenant HP was upped.  Was Revenant HP upped?  I could never kill the bastards with a point-blank double-barreled shot.  If it wasn't, maybe I was just getting bad luck.  In general, however, that room is a freaking nightmare.  You may put them further up, like wave seven or eight.
- Demons (spectres?) are surprisingly high on the list even though they aren't very difficult.  Shotgun builds make them a joke, and a well-designed rapid-fire (which would be done by the time you reach them) similarly rips them to shreds.  Unless you plan the make the captains harder, I'd put the demons in wave five instead, then buffed captains, then revs.
- Commados are HARD, man.  There's a reason you only see like, two at once in the normal game.  Seems like wave eight provides a good 8-10 of them, and that's...damn.
- The ninth wave (upgraded demons and cacos), as far as I could tell, wasn't all that difficult compared to the previous wave.  Maybe put them in the eighth slot (which, architecturally, is a better place) and move commandos to the ninth.

The change in ammo spawning is good, because weapons/ammo completely clogged the earlier levels, making it impossible for the other stuff to spawn.  The inventory space is probably unnecessary, but I like it anyway.  However, the issue is that the 10mm is STILL not quite plentiful enough to use it soundly in a rapid-fire build.  Maybe you don't want it so that people can focus on a single build, and that's okay, but if so, then you'll want to at least halve the shells.  Honestly, the x30 is a good number for shells.  I'd probably bump bullets to 100 (roughly)...the rest seem fine.

In summary, the scaling of waves is a little out of wack, and there need to be more bullets in the stacks.  This is how I would attempt to do the waves, based on the little I've played of this map:
Humans -> Sergeants -> Colonels -> Imps, Dark Imps -> Demons -> Captains (buffed) -> Cacodemons -> Revs, Blood Demons -> Commandos.

I'd start by rating the enemies according to how difficult they'd be when you can force to fight them one at a time (which is usually possible) and go from there.
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2010, 14:26 »

Game Hunter, this map is 1:1,5 scaled port of original map. In version 1.2 I'll add some pistols and try to implement Spread Rune. No monsters stats were changed in this map.
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2010, 12:55 »

v1.2: Added new weapon and a chance to win for pistol-users.
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Re: Invasion (0.9.9.1)
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2010, 22:04 »

v1.2: Added new weapon and a chance to win for pistol-users.
And how!  That weapon needs some serious nerfing.  You basically combined Trigun with a blaster...and man, you get two of them.   I'll be honest, I basically had no trouble in my pistol run after I got those.  A couple Rev hits that hurt a lot and one commando volley were the only health concerns after wave 5.  I'm glad pistol users have a better shot now (heh, pun) but, for starters, the regenerating ammo should go away.  At the very least, force the player to have reloading problems unless they choose Rel or Gun Kata.  That aside, the DPS is still rather massive.  Tweak it a little or, hell, you could just leave it as a single gun.  I love the weapon, but things are far too one-sided when you get to it.

Admittedly, prior to that the game can get really hard without SM/Rel.  My strategy in those cases is to shore up in the sergeant nook and use double shotgun into the hallway until most of them are dead.  It works well until you have to deal with the later waves, but by then your build should kick in.

As opposed to the pistol build, shotgun build gets rather difficult once you start dealing with Revs.  They typically take three full double blasts to go down (sometimes two), and the rockets can really wear you down in the meantime.  As a result, MFa appears the only viable strategy (other than rationing berserk packs properly), although that's only useful against commandos just as much.  Of course, wave 9 everything becomes easy (won't spoil why), but I suggest nerfing the stuff you get there a little bit.

I still haven't really gotten far with a rapid-fire build.  Plasma takes forever to get to, and RL is limited by the chance of enemies being far away (not as often as one would like).  Furthermore, there just aren't enough bullets for the chaingun to get through everything.  The minigun is even more useless because you have a much greater capacity to waste bullets.  If you're going to let the shotgun build fire its double against every enemy once and still have leftovers, bullet ammo needs to be increased SOMEhow.  Maybe let captains still drop it (but still in 50s like the normal drops, 100 would be overkill with the number of captains that appear).  Because it takes so long to reach anything that can use cells, that type of ammo is probably okay (I usually have a full stack by the end, more than enough for the spawns at that point).  In any case, I'll let you know when I successfully complete a rapid-fire. 

The final wave is a bit...boring.  I like the secret but, practically, it has no use being there: I can think of several weapons that outperform it for what you have to deal with.  Also:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)

You may also want to remove Invulnerability Globes entirely.  Berserk Packs mean you still take damage against significant attackers (Revs, commandos come to mind), but it's really easy to save an Invuln for the final wave and make it cake.

Game Hunter, this map is 1:1,5 scaled port of original map. In version 1.2 I'll add some pistols and try to implement Spread Rune. No monsters stats were changed in this map.
So you didn't actually change the possible spawns between 1.0 and 1.1, just the difficulty of said spawns?  Hah, weird that it turned out like that, then.  I'm looking forward to more tweaks on this map, it's a great way to quickly acclimate yourself to a particular weapon build.  (And to find some really cool weapons that are also a part of DoomRL, hint hint to everyone else.)

EDIT: To be honest, I really haven't considered Ammochain yet.  It's POSSIBLE to reach it using the double conservatively and then going crazy, but, as there are no possibilities of mods, you'd just be shooting at the air.  I'll try it out if/once EE & SoB work out.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2010, 22:10 by Game Hunter »
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