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Author Topic: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0  (Read 25195 times)

DaEezT

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #30 on: January 02, 2007, 03:59 »

I don't like this Diablo II features idea. The sequel has been ripped of a climate which was the essence of original Diablo.
I basically agree with you. D2 was not nearly as much fun as the first one was and to me that was because of all the restarting crap (see my previous posts). It was unbalanced and just designed to keep people playing to collect all the fancy items while D1 had a story with nice sidequests and well balanced gameplay.

Actually there are a few features of Diablo II that I would like in DoomRL -> like the fun additional items, or the way levelling works (the skill-tree)...
Hooray for the skill tree \o/
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Ugm

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #31 on: January 03, 2007, 07:42 »

Actually there are a few features of Diablo II that I would like in DoomRL -> like the fun additional items

Do you mean sashes or gauntlets slots in inventory or set/rare item types?

I don't like this Diablo II features idea. The sequel has been ripped of a climate which was the essence of original Diablo.
I basically agree with you. D2 was not nearly as much fun as the first one was and to me that was because of all the restarting crap (see my previous posts). It was unbalanced and just designed to keep people playing to collect all the fancy items while D1 had a story with nice sidequests and well balanced gameplay.

So I think that Kornel should create great, atmospheric and never-to-be-forgotten DiabloRL and then (after many years, of course) make (money on) widely advertised sequel with tiles, 3d sound and 1000 new items, monsters and spells with multiplayer mode for all the children who don't care about classics and say that special effects are the most important ;) Not to mention ergonomic interface (wsad and an action key which does anything apart from moving).
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TFoN

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2007, 09:18 »

when it comes to the circular part .. i dont know what (kind of monitor) your'e on :P, but they're pretty darn circular over here:

Although the only thing my computers're on is psychodelics (which may explain why one has sound and the other one works normaly :P ), I was talking about Nova/D1, Immolation/Hellfire and Poison Nova/D2:
Nova spells from D1 (and Poison Nova/D2) aren't the same as barrel explosions - they aren't realy circular, but seem to be pronged (and often miss at long range), and strictly effect-wise, none of them are filled IMO - they expand like baloons.
The screenshot shows PN alot more crowded than I had remembered it, though.


(That aside,) IMO character design should be pretty linear with D1 (no skill trees, simple percentile to-hit), but various weapon enchantments from D2 I find worth using, including rare weapons.
And I certainly agree the (horror-gore) atmosphere should be replicated and anhanced! It's what made D1 much more alive (ironically :P ) than D2.
If skill trees will be implemented, why not make it work side-by-side with books? If the mage wears full plate, the fighter should cast fireballs.

nokturnal

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #33 on: January 03, 2007, 16:44 »

Quote
I was talking about Nova/D1, Immolation/Hellfire and Poison Nova/D2:

well duh, i posted about the feature, and I was'nt talking about D1 8-)

and i really cant understand those of you who praise diablo 1 so much (for other than nostalgia reasons), imo its nothing but a demo of diablo2. is it cuz so many kids play it (EDIT: d2 that is..)? someone mentioned story? ..c'mon d2 has more story than that, and who cares about story in a dungeon crawl game anyway?
those of you who thought d2 was unbalanced, you played it when it first came out, or?
cuz i really cant think of no other game patched so notoriously gameplay wise. since v1.09-1.11 with (skill synergies etc), its imo one of if not the best balanced and replayable game out there..

and the d2 skill tree is the most brilliant one i've seen yet, an absolute must in my book!

oh, btw Kornel, no chance of a shared shash? :D or at least some way to pass at least a few cool items from one character to another (mostly thinking about class specific stuff, if that is on your list), like the Heirloom in FATE or something
« Last Edit: January 03, 2007, 17:31 by nokturnal »
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Adral

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #34 on: January 03, 2007, 17:27 »

and i really cant understand those of you who praise diablo 1 so much (for other than nostalgia reasons), imo its nothing but a demo of diablo2. is it cuz so many kids play it? someone mentioned story? ..c'mon d2 has more story than that, and who cares about story in a dungeon crawl game anyway?

Hey, different people just have different tastes, you know, and yours is no better than mine or than any other. That can also be applied for every person out there, including me :).

In my opinion, I don't care for Diablo 1, but I can understand people might enjoy a simpler game just because sometimes one wants to have a simple time, without worrying. And about story, well - I certainly enjoy a good dungeon crawl because of gameplay mechanics, items, characters, replayability, etc., but if it also has a nice story, it's just better! That's why I spent so many hours playing ADoM :P.

But sometimes it's true that you just want to get into the game and go screw up the story, so just add a "skip cutscene" option :P.

and the d2 skill tree is the most brilliant one i've seen yet, an absolute must in my book!

With this I agree with you: a well done skill tree, balanced so every skill can be useful in a certain build, it's very fun to use in order to get a nice character from the ground up. In this case, Diablo 2 (the latest version, that is also the most polished one, as you noted out) is a good example to follow. Also, another thing I like about it is that it's not overly complicated because skills are presented step by step, and you can have "higher-tier" skills without worrying that they are not balanced with other, "lower" skills.

The downside is that a narrow skill tree (be it intentional or unintentional, like having lots of useless skills) or a skill tree with lots of prerequisites just kills the replayability, because you are often forced down on the same route on each game which is boring. Also it's important that no skill becomes useless on the course of one game, or you just get that sensation of having wasted your points.

But since Kornel has so good ideas for his games, go skill tree, go!
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Ugm

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #35 on: January 04, 2007, 03:39 »

Heh, DoomRL's traits are simple (wide and short) skill tree ;) I know little about new (beta) version traits, but if some require couple of prerequisites, that tree is growing :)
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Supernaut

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #36 on: January 04, 2007, 11:12 »

Well it depends on how much would YOU like to add. I don't think that i would need more classes at the time, more importantly i would use sell & repair at shops + restock of wares. You could add bows and magic without implementing new classes  (i believe).
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Zephyre Syx

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #37 on: January 04, 2007, 16:54 »

Who's nice enough to list all the suggestions so far to include in 0.5.0?  That way we could organize and see what we have.
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Supernaut

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #38 on: January 05, 2007, 02:50 »

Here's the list for now on:

Regarding shopping:

-Sell/repair stuff
-Restock at shops
-Premium/magic items
-Other shopkeepers

Items&magic stuff:

-Basic magic system incl. books, scrolls and staves
-Attribute mods working correctly
-Ranged weapons (i mean, basic, you know;) )
-Minimum attribute requirement for items
-Set items
-Stash

Dungeons:

-More quests
-More dungeon levels
-King Leoric Quests
-Traps, Bookshelves, Sarcophages, Vaults and whatever there was in original Diablo
-Random Bosses
-Item drops from Bosses

Miscellaneous:

-'h' or '?' key for help
-Skill tree
-Sounds
-Getting rid of all the bugs


At the time you should add only the most important features. In my opinion these will be:

-Sell/repair/restock
-Basic Ranged/Magic
-Maybe increase dungeon levels and difficulty by x % ;) so that game would be a little bit challenging at start :)
-Increase the number of weapons and make them differ a little bit more from each other

I hope it is not too much. And of course, if you add more, it will be very welcome:)
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Supernaut

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #39 on: January 05, 2007, 03:04 »

and i really cant understand those of you who praise diablo 1 so much (for other than nostalgia reasons), imo its nothing but a demo of diablo2.  ..c'mon d2 has more story than that, and who cares about story in a dungeon crawl game anyway?
those of you who thought d2 was unbalanced, you played it when it first came out, or?
cuz i really cant think of no other game patched so notoriously gameplay wise. since v1.09-1.11 with (skill synergies etc), its imo one of if not the best balanced and replayable game out there..
and the d2 skill tree is the most brilliant one i've seen yet, an absolute must in my book!

IMO :

Diablo 2 has no replayability for me whatsoever. Seriously I find it boring after I beat the game for the 1st time. I don't like Multiplayer mode either. It is not better than in any freeware MMORPG available on net. Items are loads of fun at start, but then it comes only to searching for set items, which, considering rare drops from ANY monster and even chests, becomes ultra - boring over time. The same applies to skills, also because some of them are only upgraded previous skills. The gambler which is additional shop in D2 is a very stupid idea. That means you can't have really good premium items in normal shops, like in D1, but you have to pay ridiculous amount of cash, only to find that the item wasn't of any use at all.The story in D2 really has no feeling at all, and that's exactly why it sucks. Sure it is bigger, more detailed, and more original but it lacks atmosphere.

It's nice to have good ideas in a game, but when it becomes ultra - boring over time, it's not that good.
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nokturnal

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #40 on: January 05, 2007, 03:26 »

Quote
The gambler which is additional shop in D2 is a very stupid idea. That means you can't have really good premium items in normal shops, like in D1, but you have to pay ridiculous amount of cash, only to find that the item wasn't of any use at all.

this i agree with, even tho i find gambling all your money away in d2 quite fun, i'd much rather have a better shop with a rare item or such, from time to time..
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Ugm

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #41 on: January 05, 2007, 04:18 »

Regarding shopping:

-Other shopkeepers

Do you mean Adria and Wirt or whole bunch of new salesmen? :P

Items&magic stuff:

-Set items

Ok, but what's with the rare type?

At the time you should add only the most important features. In my opinion these will be:

-Maybe increase dungeon levels and difficulty by x % ;) so that game would be a little bit challenging at start :)

Hmm... The game is now quite boring but you're right, if all these features are implemented, the game will be too easy. Now the only problem is lack of potions at the start (beacuse of crappy weapon/armor and getting hit by scavengers :P ).

-Increase the number of weapons and make them differ a little bit more from each other

Do you mean adding completely new weapons or just adding more from the original?
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Supernaut

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #42 on: January 05, 2007, 06:14 »

Hmmm i mean adding different weapons like different hammers, knives, staves, and stuff. Right now you only have swords, which all do similar damage.  Make them do different damage or maybe hit more/less time per turn, because i think they are not hmmm recognisable? At the time.

And you know, for me the game wasn't quite boring as i completed it in 15 minutes. I didn't have time to got bored.
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vodnyk

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #43 on: January 05, 2007, 07:03 »

As I play through I really miss WAIT button :-) - easy to implement, great help while playing.
Much harder would be my second feature: Timing. I think that ADOM has one of the best systems how to bring action in turn based enviromet. How it works(schematically): every creature (including player) have its own speed (say 100). each TICK you get so many action points(AP)into your 'APs bank' as is your speed. When you want to attack or move etc. you have to pay it with your APs. Example:Normal attack cost 1000 AP, slow attack 1200AP, casting(for warrior)1500AP, casting for mage 800AP. Every TICK when you have more then 1000 AP you can act, APs are substreacted (you can have - APs) and you(the creature...) are waiting till your APs are above 1000. On the first wiew it looks complicated, but it looks really cool when it is working, you can add lot of features(see - different casting/attacking rates for classes) not only zombie acting every second turn.
I thought about this system and I see possibility for little change, which brings situations like "interrupting attacks". When your APs are above 0 you can act(walk, attack, cast) but the efect is NOT immediate, but it  takes place after your APs are again above 0. If someone attacks you in this time, he can interrupt (with some probability) your effort. Of course it aplies to creatures as well...
« Last Edit: January 05, 2007, 07:05 by vodnyk »
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Ugm

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Re: Building a feature list for DiabloRL 0.5.0
« Reply #44 on: January 05, 2007, 17:06 »

vodnyk, I think that time, energy or how you call it based turn system is already implemented. It's just not used much (and thus noticable), beacuse of early stage of game development.

Supernaut - the game is not replayable for now, try to complete it several more times. I'm sure you'll get bored ;)
More weapon types - strongly needed, not so hard to add. Would be nice variation even if there were no other classes than warrior.
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