DRL > Discussion
Shotgun Build discussion.
ultimate26:
How come tactical shotgun is better than assault shotgun according to the wiki?
can anybody give me a tier list of shotguns? why is elephant shotgun considered good when you can go tactical or focused double shotty instead?
To me it feels as if the P mods are really rare, i see tons of As and Ts somtimes Bs.
Plasma shotgun any good? with damage reduction how much different is it from a Tactical shotgun? they are both mentioned as 15 average damage.
AlterAsc:
It's hard to make tier list.After all what's best for you depends on your build.
Elephant Gun is the most ammo efficient not requiring WK assemble.Without Shottyman nearly useless due to 2.5s reload time.Mostly used when playing MAD since it blocks Fin.
Tactical and assault are the same except difference in number of damage dices.Focused blast, good for cornershooting, don't require traits to be useful.
DS - wide blast, 2s reload time, useless if enemy is not close.FDS - normal blast, requires WK, pretty good.
Plasma shotgun - unique blast and plasma damage( so halved armor reduction instead of doubled).But eats cells.
Jackhammer - eats shells extremely fast.Useful sometimes.
P-mods seems rare to me too, but according to wiki all normal mods have the same weight,meaning equal chances.
HenWen:
Ultimate I think a tier list is somewhat difficult because the different shotguns have very different roles. Some shotguns have more spread than others, others have more DPS, and others are more ammo-efficient. Here is a basic breakdown though:
TIER 0: Regular shotgun
TIER 1: Combat shotgun; Double shotgun; Elephant Gun
TIER 2: Tactical shotgun; Focused double shotgun;
TIER 2.5: Assault shotgun; Plasma shotgun (?)
TIER 3: Super Shotgun, Pancor Jackhammer.
I did not list the nanoshrapnel assembly because I haven't tested it. A little explanation:
Tier 0 - the regular shotgun is pretty average, no outstanding abilities or penalties.
Tier 1 - These three shotguns are better at different roles. The Double Shotgun is invaluable for fighting lost souls and pain elementals, the wider spread is invaluable. This is even usable for non shotgun-based builds now due to the shell box. However, it sucks at range and is less ammo-efficient than a regular shotgun. The combat shotgun is one of the best weapons in the game for any build, because it is extremely efficient at corner shooting and radar shooting, and uses common ammunition. It is more effective at range than the other shotguns of this tier. The elephant gun does less damage per time fired than the double, but does more damage per shell than any shotgun until the super shotgun, meaning it has a niche role to fill.
Tier2: The two assemblies offer minor but significant improvements. Your tactical shotty will not need pumping, making it even better for corner shooting, while the focused double shotty is more ammo efficient. But because the assemblies limit the number of mods that can be applied they are listed at this tier.
Tier2.5: The assault shotgun is almost identical to the tactical shotgun. It has 1 more ammo in its magazine and does 1d3 less damage per shot. The only advantage is that it can be modded. A P3 assault shotgun is a beautiful, beautiful thing. Thus it is only better for builds with levels in whizkid.
I listed the plasma shotgun here due to a lack of experience with it. I believe it uses 5 plasma rounds per shot, but is armor piercing, faster to reload, and has a larger effective magazine than either the tactical or assault shotties. Probably good for shotgun builds to have an alternative ammo to use, but for builds not so constrained the plasma rifle is probably better.
Tier3: These are the uber weapons. The Super shotgun is a significant upgrade over the double and focused double shotguns. You can even fire one shell at a time for the most damaging weapon per shell fired. The Pancor fires two shells at once like a double, but can carry a large magazine and its damage is better at range like a tactical - best of both worlds.
Ultimate the performance of the plasma depends entirely on how much armor your target has. Most regular creatures have no more than 2 base armor, which is doubled vs regular shotgun shrapnel and halved vs plasma, leading to three more damage. This isn't too important at point blank range, but lets say your target is 7 tiles away from you:
7d3 - 14 damage average. 7 tiles distance = 35% damage reduction, so roughly 10 damage at 7 tiles. After armor, this will be 6 damage for the regular combat shotgun and 9 damage for the plasma.
If you are radar shooting distant mobs at say 12 tiles, that is a 60% damage reduction. The regular combat will deal 7 damage, reduced by armor to 3, while the plasma will deal 6. As you can see, the greater the range, the more important the damage type is.
spacedust:
I love shotguns!
If you want a quick and dirty build to learn shotgunning basics, I suggest this:
Scout: Int->Int->Rel->Rel, then possibly going to Shottyhead from there.
Learn enemy movement patterns by watching them using Int. Also, get a feel for how to shoot them such that they cannot shoot you back.
If you are planning to play a shotgun-only build, Reloader is very very important in the beginning. There's nothing worse than seeing a pack of demons converge on you and not being able to knock them back fast enough because your shotty takes too long to reload.
A vanilla shotgun can take you very far provided you play tactically. That means firing shots into blank spaces and listening for enemy cries, and retreating to corners. I cannot emphasize the second point enough. Retreat to corners and fire around them!
If ammo is plentiful and you have no need to conserve, let it rip once you hear an enemy pain cry. Conversely, if you're low on ammo, wait for them to come closer so that they feel the full effect of shells.
Everything better than a vanilla shotgun is heaven!
ih8regin:
played today an AoSh run, got blessed with a Jackhammer - ruined it all when ran out of ammo at level 1 Hell, rage quit. Whacking with Jackhammer against lost souls is counter-productive :) I didn't have shottyman at that point, as I went into Int2, Juggler and DM first.
SO far I expect the best dedicated shotgun build with the scout is Int-Int-Rel-Rel-SM-HR-HR-DM-Fin-either into MSH or WK, depending of mods abundance. Tactical shotgun is a must I guess.
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