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[NeonBuddha]

First Post.
Still new, Still learning the new levels, but reading all the mortems on here
 has really helped me out, and I've found a few builds that I really like.
 Still have no idea how people play on the harder difficulties!

But here is a story for you all.

--------------------------------------------------------------
 DoomRL (0.9.9.7) roguelike post-mortem character dump
--------------------------------------------------------------

 Moog, level 9 Demon Corporal Technician,
 couldn't evade a revenant's fireball on level 4 of Hell.
 He survived 93791 turns and scored 61009 points.
 He played for 1 hour, 36 minutes and 11 seconds.
 He didn't like it too rough.

 He killed 459 out of 498 hellspawn. (92%)
 He held his right to remain violent.
 He was an Angel of Marksmanship!

-- Special levels --------------------------------------------

  Levels generated : 11
  Levels visited   : 6
  Levels completed : 4

-- Awards ----------------------------------------------------

  Hell Armorer Badge
  Marksman Bronze Badge

-- Graveyard -------------------------------------------------

  ===========================================================
  ===================================V=======================
  ====================%%%%==============....=================
  ======.%.%==========.&..==============.i&.==========...%===
  =====%%....=========..%.===========B==.R%.=========.%%...==
  =====%....%=========..%.==============%..%=========%.....==
  =====..%.%.========================================%%...%==
  ======%%%%=================##====##=================%..%===
  ===========================#.....##========================
  ============================.....%=========================
  ============================..X%%.=========================
  ======================R====##^.%[##========================
  ======..V.===========M=====##====##=================..%.===
  =====.....A====================V===================....%.==
  =====%.%..B=========V...==============.%%%=========%%%...==
  =====..R.R.=========....R=============.%.%=========%%....==
  ======....==========BV.i==============%%&.==========%...===
  ====================....==============..%.=================
  ===========================================================
  ===========================================================

-- Statistics ------------------------------------------------

  Health 0/50   Experience 38220/9
  ToHit Ranged +6  ToHit Melee +6  ToDmg Ranged +0  ToDmg Melee +0

-- Traits ----------------------------------------------------

  Class : Technician

    Son of a gun     (Level 3)
    Eagle Eye        (Level 3)
    Whizkid          (Level 2)
    Sharpshooter     (Level 1)

  SoG->SoG->EE->WK->SoG->EE->EE->MSs->WK->

-- Equipment -------------------------------------------------

    [a] [ Armor      ]   nothing
    [b] [ Weapon     ]   storm combat pistol (1d9)x2 [22/22]
    [c] [ Boots      ]   environmental protective boots [2/2] (96%)
    [d] [ Prepared   ]   nothing

-- Inventory -------------------------------------------------

    [a] BFG 10K (6d4)x5 [50/50]
     phaseshift armor [4/4] (87%) (P)
    [c] 10mm ammo (x100)
    [d] 10mm ammo (x100)
    [e] 10mm ammo (x100)
    [f] 10mm ammo (x30)
    [g] 10mm ammo (x100)
    [h] 10mm ammo (x100)
    [i] 10mm ammo (x100)
    [j] large med-pack
    [k] large med-pack
    [l] homing phase device
    [m] homing phase device
    [n] power mod pack
    [/i][/b][list][b][/b][list][li][b][i] technical mod pack[/i][/b][/li][/list][b][/b][list][li][b][i][p] agility mod pack
    [q] agility mod pack
    [/i][/b][/li][/list][b][/b][/list][b][i][r] agility mod pack
    [s] agility mod pack
    [t] fire skull
    [u] 10mm ammo chain (x250)

-- Resistances -----------------------------------------------

    Acid       - internal 0%    torso 0%    feet 90% 
    Fire       - internal 0%    torso 0%    feet 75% 

-- Kills -----------------------------------------------------

    97 former humans
    71 former sergeants
    20 former captains
    79 imps
    65 demons
    62 lost souls
    14 cacodemons
    8 hell knights
    10 barons of hell
    5 arachnotrons
    8 former commandos
    4 pain elementals
    2 revenants
    2 mancubi
    1 arch-vile
    5 elite former humans
    2 elite former sergeants
    2 bruiser brothers
    1 shambler
    1 Cyberdemon

-- History ---------------------------------------------------

  He started his journey on the surface of Phobos.
  On level 5 he stormed the Chained Court.
  On level 5 he assembled a tactical boots!
  On level 7 he marched into the Military Base.
  On level 7 he assembled a storm bolter pistol!
  He purified his fellow comrades.
  On level 8 he encountered the Phobos Anomaly.
  On level 8 he assembled a ballistic armor!
  On level 9 he entered Hell's Armory.
  On level 9 he assembled a storm bolter pistol!
  He destroyed the evil within and reaped the rewards!
  On level 14 he ventured into the Halls of Carnage.
  On level 14 he assembled a environmental boots!
  On level 16 he found the Tower of Babel!
  On level 19 he entered the Vaults.
  He came, he saw, but he left.
  On level 20 he found the BFG 10K!
  On level 20 he was foolish enough to enter Limbo!
  On level 20 he finally couldn't evade a revenant's fireball.

-- Messages --------------------------------------------------

 You see : an arch-vile (scratched) | bridge | [ m ]ore
 The missile hits the arch-vile. The missile hits the arch-vile. The arch-vile
 raises his arms!
 Fire -- Choose target...
 You see : an arch-vile (wounded) | bridge | [ m ]ore
 The missile hits the arch-vile. The missile hits the arch-vile.
 Fire -- Choose target...
 You see : an arch-vile (scratched) | bridge | [ m ]ore
 The missile hits the arch-vile.
 You reload the storm combat pistol. Your ballistic red armor is damaged! You
 are engulfed in flames! Argh!!! Lava!
 You use a large med-pack. You feel fully healed. Argh!!! Lava!
 The arch-vile raises his arms! You are hit! Your ballistic red armor is
 completely destroyed!
 The arch-vile raises his arms! You are hit! You are hit! You die!... Press
 <Enter>...

-- General ---------------------------------------------------

 15 brave souls have ventured into Phobos:
 13 of those were killed.
 And 1 couldn't handle the stress and committed a stupid suicide.

 1 souls destroyed the Mastermind...
 1 killed the bitch and survived.

--------------------------------------------------------------
[/u][/s][/i][/b]
This run was going great. So great in fact, that I built a storm combat pistol.
 I don't know if you have used one yourself, but the advantages over the normal storm pistol are enormous.
So I hit level 19, look at the stairs:
Sign reads Limbo. So I check my inventory:
Plenty of medkits: Check
Homing Phase Device (in case things get rough): Check
Fire Skull (Wiki says that there are lots of viles on the other side of this thing)
.... Check. (This will become important in a second).

Well, I don't really need anything else to kill mastermind;
I have huge dps, I have plenty of health kits.
But lets do this level anyways.

So what happens?
I check the wiki, and I see.... the page is a little lackluster =(
Well, I'm a big badass, I can at least make it out of this one alive. (Mistake Number One)
*Walks down Stairs*
Oh hey, lots of  viles. Well, I can knock them into lava, and they will die fast.
 Hope I can kill most of them before they start rezzing corpses. (Mistake Number Two)
*gets shot up real bad, still alive*
Well, I can just pop a large health kit and keep fighting*
Mistake NUMBER THREE, Ladies and Gentlemen.
And the next turn I was dead.

So what should I have done? Popped fire skull first turn down the stairs.
 Because what happened the first turn the Arch-Viles started doing things? Hell baron. Revenant.
Knocked into the lava. Lost my armor completely. Blown up the turn immediately after.

What else could I have done? Homing Phase and peace out.

YASD.

[Evilpotatoe]

I'm not sure Limbo/Mortuary are the best places for an AoMr, but anyway, what could you do ?
Shoot, of course !

*With the insane damages of a sharpshooter, viles go down very fast, and so do their summons. (shoot viles first, btw)
*Equipping an ammo box to avoid dying during reloads is a good idea.
*Usually, having one or two hatred skulls helps a lot for mortuary (clear corpse, but also makes you berserk, which is a huge buff in speed and resistances, giving you much more time before you need to consume medkiits or supercharges.) Blood skulls are not that useful. Fire skulls suck (well, they still clear corpse, but I don't think they are worth an inventory slot, except if recently buffed.)
*Go asap in the upper right to get the nuclear BFG for clearing enemies & corpses (not a valid choice in AoMr, of course, but it's usually what I do in normal runs). Harder in Limbo too, since floor is quite hot :)

Other alternatives include leaving the level, nuking it, dying in, or making a save when entering, so you can train and understand how it works (I was really too much ****** off by improved Chain courts as AoMr, so after 5 or more promising chars dead here, I just switched to training mode, and after many attemps (50 ?), including more and more successful ones as I was playing, I continued my game (and made it !).

[Klear]

or making a save when entering, so you can train and understand how it works (I was really too much by improved Chain courts as AoMr, so after 5 or more promising chars, I just switched to training mode, and after many attemps (20 ? 50 ?), including more and more successful ones as I was playing, I continued my game (and made it !).

I would advise against this. The temptation to continue doing this is too high, it's better to never even start. My strategy for dealing with the Mortuary in my early days? Skip it. Skip it by all that is holy. That place is not meant for unexperienced players =)

[Radagast]

My strategy for dealing with the Mortuary in my early days? Skip it. Skip it by all that is holy. That place is not meant for unexperienced players =)

True I skipped it a few times too, depends on the build actually, but to be honest after some tries and deaths in there, my experience in the game was vastly improved. Or at least, I think so. :P Some times hard challenges do improve the player a lot, much faster than playing on easy mode all the time. Just my two cents concerning difficulty levels.

[Evilpotatoe]

I would advise against this. The temptation to continue doing this is too high

Bah, depends on your playstyle...
I continued several attemps a little, and at least one to the end, indeed (I found Trigun, combat pistol, other pistol(s), Necroarmor, Malek's, and other insane stuff...) but I played all of this in my "LameRL" directory, and didn't register anything in my real profile :)

From my point of view, training is something extremely valuable. Sometimes very boring too (playing CC so much wasn't always fun), but it really makes you progress.
I did the same in UV Hell's armory, since I didn't manage to get shambler's head.... and realized how easy it was (in 0.9.9.6). Maybe I'd find that difficulty didn't increase so much in 0.9.9.7 if I praticed a little more :)

Anyway, the point, for me, is that there's no reason to play 5 levels before entering Chain Courts if the only thing you need to train is CC, so save seems like the best solution.
I agree that you need some will to avoid profiting of it, but it shouldn't be too hard for a RL player.
You may also consider it's cheating, of course (technically, roguelikes are not supposed to let you scum... it's right), but from my point of view, training is something else. As long as I manage to leave any promising training result, I don't see any problem using it. Descending 50 times in the mortuary to die during your first moves doesn't seem very interesting to me :)   (and on a funny note, I never scummed mortuary... I did once, late, to try some strategies, but figured out several ways of clearing it without feeling the need for any training. Quite fun, considering it's probably one of the hardest levels)

[LuckyDee]

Well played. Learning curves can be steep, but by golly, learn you shall!

I have to agree with Klear though; steer clear of the Mortuary/Limbo until you get a grip on the game. You don't need to specifically go there, and it can be a death trap even for more experienced players.

And about higher difficulties: yeah, I agree. I need to (re)start doing HMP again, and I'm kinda putting it of for being a sore loser :S

Give it time though, and lots of practice. The trick is not to quit, just keep playing till you die. Sometimes you'll surprise yourself by how long you manage to stay alive.

[Klear]

Hmmm.. I never felt the need to practice anything. And I assured you, until recently, I was absolutely terrified of the unchained court and only went there on specific builds when I knew I have a good chance to survive. Then I found out that suddenly I can pass it most of the time (which might be because I improved, or simply because the subtle layout changes in 997 made it a tad easier) and so I enter it more often. I'm still a little afraid of it, but that just makes the game better.

Same thing with Mortuary. The day I first passed it (with a Vampyre build) was a cause for celebration, and it took quite some time until I managed to clear it on a non-melee build. I doubt I'd have the same feeling if it came after this kind of training.

I'm not judging you for this, merely voicing my opinion that it can rob you of a lot of satisfaction you can get from this game.

[LuckyDee]

What I mean by practice is just 'lotsa runs', to help build up a feel for how the game works; not doing fiddly stuff with save games and whatnot. Just worship/play/play.

[White Rider]

Homing phase on Mortuary/Limbo is a good idea.
Homing phase on Mortuary/Limbo as a Technician is a very good idea.

[SageAcrin]

Practicing specific areas with a single save file can be a trap, anyways.

Sure, you get it down to a science with a specific build. Then what? Always use that build? How are you going to handle, say, half the Angels, then?

Doing full runs is always better. Potentially more frustrating (says the person that just lost an HMP YAAM AoI run on Hell:7, that was sure to take out Mastermind.), but better.

[Q2ZOv]

Hey, nobody mentioned here, and maybe everyone knows that viles take no damage from fluids, so no point in knocking them into the lava. In fact, while standing in lava and surrounded by lava they won't ever move, so they will spend every turn on attacking or reviving, so usually you should try to avoid this to happen.

If something from above was changed in 0.9.9.7 please correct me.

[tylor]

Mortuary is different and harder than rest of the game so much, it's really worth making a save before it and do some runs, to get hang of it. It lets you try some thing you would be afraid to otherwise.

[Tormuse]

Personally, I would advise against going into Mortuary/Limbo in AoMr in any case.  I don't like going in there while restricted to weapons that only let me kill one enemy at a time.  (I prefer being able to use Rocket Launchers and/or BFGs, although, if you have a Hatred Skull, a melee build is pretty good in there too)  :)

[LuckyDee]

Hey, nobody mentioned here, and maybe everyone knows that viles take no damage from fluids, so no point in knocking them into the lava. In fact, while standing in lava and surrounded by lava they won't ever move, so they will spend every turn on attacking or reviving, so usually you should try to avoid this to happen.

If something from above was changed in 0.9.9.7 please correct me.

Believe you're right, I spent a pretty large number of turns waiting for them to drop dead, to no avail.

[SageAcrin]

Believe you're right, I spent a pretty large number of turns waiting for them to drop dead, to no avail.

On the upside, if you have a weapon that won't knock them out of the situation, you can drop them into lava and then wander out of LoS, pelting them with bullets until they die.

It's not all bad.