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Author Topic: Switches should affect the level layout  (Read 1704 times)

Infinitum

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Switches should affect the level layout
« on: April 26, 2013, 08:12 »

In Doom, pulling a switch meant changed the level layout somehow - opening a door, raising a platform, lowering walls, what have you. Worst case scenario you triggered an ambush and got some goodies as compensation. Here.. it's more akin to reading an un-id'd scroll, pulling random stunts that is nothing like the original game and with a bad enough risk/reward ratio that pulling them just isn't worth it without points in Intuition. There are instances where they work where the player groks them to, such as in special levels, but there's no reason why they couldn't work like this all the while.

I'd like to see each switch being linked to some sort of terrain feature on the level - such as raising (or lowering) a bridge through hazardous pools, opening or closing doors to otherwise inaccesible areas. Triggering ambushes (proper ones, lowering walls to inaccessinble alcoves and not just spawning monsters). Turning the level lights on or off (increasing or decreasing the players LOS). One way switches. Persistent switches (such as operating presses for fun and profit). Switches that are only active for a limited amount of time (forcing the player to run gauntlets or the like).

Anything but what they are now.
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tdef

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #1 on: April 26, 2013, 08:31 »

due to the random generated nature of levels i'd say it's undoable except for premade levels (which some of do already, see the limbo)
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ZicherCZ

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #2 on: April 26, 2013, 08:46 »

Don't forget that the levels are for the most part randomly generated, and most as the effects the OP describes needs to be scripted. The levels, compared to other RLs, are very small, so such effects would have to be very rare.
Raising and lowering bridges? Sounds fun, with some of the recent new level layouts.
Triggering ambushes is already implemented, and not only in special levels. Sometimes a vault is open by a lever even in a normal level.
Increasing or decreasing LOS can work similarly to Light-Amps, that are already present, and while it sounds interesting, it also sounds a bit redundant (you do have the light-amps already, and "dark-amps" would mostly simply force the player to hide until the effect wears off).
One way switches and persistent switches - can you please elaborate? I'm not quite sure what to make of it.
Switches active only for a limited amount of time - nope. I personally operate switches only when I either have Int, or when the level is safe, or when I'm really desperate. I would certainly never hurry to a lever just because it may disappear.
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SageAcrin

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #3 on: April 26, 2013, 10:16 »

It doesn't seem too awfully hard to have rivers have a chance to generate a switch that makes a bridge across them.

Since switches are often as dangerous as crossing the damage tiles would be, it would mostly be neat.

You could probably do something similar with those rooms that seem to just generate full of acid/lava-add a switch somewhere on the level that drains them and lets you pass. They're awfully pointless in general(since past F8 or so you probably have a way to punch through walls and go around, and before that they do way too much damage to just ford.).

Anything more complicated than that seems like it won't really happen outside of a preset level though.
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Equality

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #4 on: April 26, 2013, 10:31 »

because of random layout you can appear at one side of lava river and switch for bridge on another. Is this help you a lot?
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Infinitum

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2013, 16:40 »

1) Cross river

2) raise bridge

3) Wait for enemies attempting to follow

4) flip switch

5) profit.

Also, I don't see how ready-made map sections containing alcoves for enemies or loot to be released once certain criteria are met (player walking nearby, switches placed in front of or scattered around the level etc) isn't doable. The map generator already has a number of set pieces it chooses from - adding a few more with some scripted behaviour surely cannot be -that- hard, especially considering vaults in this and other roguelikes often sport similar mechanisms?
« Last Edit: April 26, 2013, 16:41 by Infinitum »
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SageAcrin

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2013, 16:58 »

Quote
because of random layout you can appear at one side of lava river and switch for bridge on another. Is this help you a lot?

That's true enough, but because of random layouts, bridges can also get blown up.

It's not necessarily harmful or anything.

And yeah, toggling bridges off would be impractical to allow. Too abusable considering how boring it is. (Even moreso on N!-kill dudes on bridge, raise bridge, lower bridge. Corpse disposal made easy.)
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Nick

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Re: Switches should affect the level layout
« Reply #7 on: April 27, 2013, 02:40 »

Actually, switches and RNG mix well. But it's a really big work. It will be the most complicated level generation algorithm in whole DoomRL. It's not just "take levels as they are now and add switches".
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