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Author Topic: What's with Frag Shotgun?  (Read 3564 times)

Nick

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What's with Frag Shotgun?
« on: December 01, 2013, 09:57 »

Will you do something with it? Bump from unique 7d3 to exotic 8d3, turn into Dum-Dum shotgun ( http://forum.chaosforge.org/index.php/topic,6111.150.html ), something else?
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LuckyDee

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #1 on: December 01, 2013, 11:41 »

I've had a look through the thread you're referring to, regarding the dum-dum rifle, and although I'm in no position to offer an official statement on this, I think it's safe to say that with the arrival of Jupiter Hell, you're going to have to be a little more patient.

What I did do was have another look at the Wiki for the Frag Shotgun - I found it for the very first time in one of last month's runs and had forgotten all about your earlier comments on it - and found this:

Quote
Comments/special:    This weapon is overnerfed because of it's "beta" nature.

If I understand the rather shaky UI correctly, it was you who made this contribution. Is that correct, and if so, what prompted you to do so please?
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Nick

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #2 on: December 01, 2013, 12:10 »

Yeah, these things are strongly correlated. As far as I remember, in one of the short discussions (not in my big thread) someone asked "why it's so weak" and the answer was sorta "because it's a weapon of ,,what-if`` concept, not a ripe fruit". So I've mentioned that in the wiki comments; and than, all of sudden, I've got a good idea. Why guessing if I can just come here and ask: are you really still going to do something with it? Or maybe I should remove my comment? So I've asked.
Ahem... maybe I should ask BEFORE I fill the "comment" field... Sprytne pomysły są zawsze późno.

I wish to have such a thing IRL someday O_o
« Last Edit: December 01, 2013, 12:11 by Nick »
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LuckyDee

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #3 on: December 01, 2013, 12:53 »

"because it's a weapon of ,,what-if`` concept, not a ripe fruit". So I've mentioned that in the wiki comments

Although I can't say whether this is wrong or right, I would say that the wiki comments are no place for statements like this, especially since it's neither a solid fact (like the Fire Angel trait not working in 0996) nor an official stance (like the support of the Dragon Slayer secrecty).

You are of course more than welcome to debate the matter over here.
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Nick

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #4 on: December 01, 2013, 13:13 »

Quote
the wiki comments are no place for statements like this
I hadn't any guidelines clear enough to figure out where the exact limit is. Even though they're still questionable, I don't see any reason to keep this comment opened another tab, removed the comment from the wiki.
Something else?

BTW wonder if it's spread will work with Demolition Ammo without engine bugs...
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ZicherCZ

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #5 on: December 01, 2013, 23:41 »

I hadn't any guidelines clear enough to figure out where the exact limit is. Even though they're still questionable, I don't see any reason to keep this comment opened another tab, removed the comment from the wiki.
Something else?
Well, the Frag Shotgun page belongs to the Game Information section, and "DO NOT add your opinions in these pages regarding their subject matter." in the section description on the very welcome page of the Wiki sounds like all the guidelines needed.
There are discussion pages for each Wiki page. Use those.

BTW wonder if it's spread will work with Demolition Ammo without engine bugs...
Not gonna happen - you can't mod uniques (except some very very few ones). It does sound interesting, though :).
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Nick

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #6 on: December 02, 2013, 02:51 »

As the thread says, it wasn't my personal opinion. Enough words, let's see, how it was.
4: we don't know yet.
5:
Quote
Although I can't say whether this is wrong or right, I would say that the wiki comments are no place for statements like this
the clear answer which allowed to choose (6) without having (4).
« Last Edit: December 02, 2013, 02:56 by Nick »
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Nick

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #7 on: December 02, 2013, 03:05 »

Quote
Not gonna happen - you can't mod uniques

It was an assumption:

if ( PositionOne = TRUE) AND (ParametersAfterBump = Rare_8d3) THEN BEGIN
***
TryAssembly(DemolitionAmmo);
***
END;
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Nick

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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2013, 05:57 »

I think it's time to check my other edits. Some of them balance on the wedge between "opinions" and "explanations". You decide.
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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #9 on: December 02, 2013, 18:42 »

Alright, this passive-aggressive exchange has gone on enough.  Keep Wiki contents factual -- leave all speculation and wrangling to the forums, that's why these two different avenues exist.  If there was ever any doubt over the interpretation, this doubt ends now.

As for suggestions and their implementations, there is never a guarantee that anything was suggested gets implemented, no matter how good or how terrible the idea is.  Some things appear "simple" on paper but are devilishly hard to do in code, while others don't fall into the vision that the devs had.  Or the devs just simply refuse to add that suggestion -- it's all their prerogative.

Annoying the devs by asking [incessantly] about any particular suggestion just does not help it much, Jupiter Hell work notwithstanding.
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Re: What's with Frag Shotgun?
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2013, 01:50 »

This thread is weird, but there is indeed something with the Frag Shotgun.

For one that it's half as ammo efficient as a normal shotgun that uses shells, another that it's an assault shotgun with a slightly smaller magazine.
Then there's that thing about it shooting 1.5x as slowly and takes quite a while to reload unless you have shottyman.

Which makes it pretty much only useful for shottyhead builds that are running out of shells and are facing truckloads of former captains.
oh and it's a shotgun unique that's less useful than all the shotgun exotics and much, much worse than the other shotgun unique
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