DRL > Discussion
The Journey to 100%
Sereg:
Brilliant theorycrafting there - if you can keep that up, you'll have a definite edge approaching your remaining Angelic challenges.
For Dervis, I don't recommend max carnage. There's no reason you need to be killing anything other then what's directly in your path to the stairs, so I'd recommend a melee stairdive as a scout. It may take a few attempts before you get it rolling, but once you do it'll go fast... you won't need to leave the computer running overnight.
For reference I submit my Dervis mortem, which I completed in under an hour real-time.
Icy:
Thanks guys! :)
That's good to know that Angel of 100 on Nightmare doesn't actually take very long at all! Maybe I'll try for some tonight then.
Day 61:
Not much in terms of progress! I played some for Everyman Diamond Badge, and while it's functionally the same as the way I did Everyman Platinum Badge, the bump up to Ultra-Violence is enough where it's significantly harder to complete. More enemies, more damage, and the bonus levels require extra Med-Packs when using Azrael's. No luck on completing it yet.
I also tried for some Quartermaster Diamond Badge with use of Max Carnage. I had a few good runs, but died in all of them. Arachnotrons and Former Commandos are brutal. :(
Playing for Quartermaster Diamond Badge is a lot of fun, so I'll probably focus on that next. That's all for now!
Icy:
Day 62:
Good progress this day! First was more attempts at Quartermaster Diamond Badge. For the most part, gameplay is just based around not getting hit and making sure to find the stairs while exploring the levels. There's usually enough time to be killing every enemy with Max Carnage, except for the odd cases where they're teleporting around, or they become difficult to control. As you get further into the game, the difficulty stays roughly the same, maybe a bit easier as you get more useful traits to speed up, as well as buffed up weapons. A Plasma Rifle with plenty of ammo is enough to clear entire floors very fast!
Some screenshots; I went for a full clear on Hell's Armory and barely escaped in time:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
On one floor, I had a double Invulnerability stacked near each other but didn't know where the stairs were. The floor was a "city" and one of the rooms hadn't been explored in, yet it turned out the stairs was on a random dark tile I hadn't checked yet. Fortunately before discovering that, I decided to use my Homing Phase Device after grabbing the Invulnerabilities, and it also turned out to be a good idea for the following floor:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
The rest of the run was pretty basic stuff. It's not too hard of a challenge, but it's a fairly long game where you can't make too many mistakes for the entire duration. Each floor individually is easy, but playing flawlessly as a whole is a bit tough.
Spoiler (click to show/hide)--------------------------------------------------------------
DoomRL (0.9.9.7) roguelike post-mortem character dump
--------------------------------------------------------------
hgsd, level 13 Apostle Chaos Br. General Scout,
defeated the Mastermind at the City of Dis.
He survived 53039 turns and scored 320297 points.
He played for 1 hour, 12 minutes and 28 seconds.
He was a man of Ultra-Violence!
He killed 757 out of 757 hellspawn. (100%)
This ass-kicking marine killed all of them!
He was an Angel of Max Carnage!
He was also an Angel of Red Alert!
-- Special levels --------------------------------------------
Levels generated : 11
Levels visited : 1
Levels completed : 1
-- Awards ----------------------------------------------------
Medal of Prejudice
UAC Star (gold cluster)
Untouchable Badge
Hell Arena Key
Quartermaster Diamond Badge
-- Graveyard -------------------------------------------------
###########################################################
###################...........X....................########
##################...............####...%...........#######
#################.......####.....####.....####.......######
################........####.....####.....####........#####
###############.........####.....####.....####.........####
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################........####.....####.....####........#####
#################.......####.....####.....####.......######
##################...............####...............#######
###################................................########
###########################################################
-- Statistics ------------------------------------------------
Health 50/50 Experience 76518/13
ToHit Ranged +12 ToHit Melee +12 ToDmg Ranged +0 ToDmg Melee +0
-- Traits ----------------------------------------------------
Class : Scout
Finesse (Level 2)
Hellrunner (Level 3)
Reloader (Level 2)
Juggler (Level 1)
Dodgemaster (Level 1)
Intuition (Level 2)
Shottyman (Level 1)
Shottyhead (Level 1)
Int->Int->HR->HR->DM->Fin->Jug->Fin->Rel->Rel->SM->MSh->HR->
-- Equipment -------------------------------------------------
[a] [ Armor ] duelist armor [4/4] (64%) (P)
[b] [ Weapon ] plasma rifle (1d8)x6 [10/40] (P1)
[c] [ Boots ] tactical boots [0/0] (100%)
[d] [ Prepared ] nothing
-- Inventory -------------------------------------------------
[a] tactical shotgun (8d3) [5/5]
[b] rocket launcher (6d6) [1/1] (T1)
[c] red armor [4/4] (100%) (T)
[d] red armor [4/4] (100%) (T)
[e] shotgun shell (x30)
[f] power cell (x36)
[g] power cell (x50)
[h] power cell (x50)
[i] power cell (x50)
[j] power cell (x50)
[k] power cell (x50)
[l] large med-pack
[m] phase device
[n] phase device
[o] Hell Staff
[p] shell box (x12)
[q] rocket box (x6)
-- Resistances -----------------------------------------------
Bullet - internal 0% torso 50% feet 0%
Melee - internal 0% torso 50% feet 0%
Shrapnel - internal 0% torso 50% feet 0%
-- Kills -----------------------------------------------------
66 former humans
67 former sergeants
27 former captains
174 imps
79 demons
146 lost souls
27 cacodemons
20 hell knights
39 barons of hell
10 arachnotrons
11 former commandos
15 pain elementals
32 revenants
19 mancubi
21 arch-viles
2 bruiser brothers
1 Cyberdemon
1 Spider Mastermind
-- History ---------------------------------------------------
He started his journey on the surface of Phobos.
On level 2 he entered Hell's Arena.
He saw, left a present and left.
On level 8 he encountered the Phobos Anomaly.
On level 12 he found the Anti-Freak Jackal!
He sounded the alarm on level 15!
On level 15 he assembled a tactical shotgun!
On level 15 he assembled a tactical boots!
On level 16 he found the Tower of Babel!
He sounded the alarm on level 18!
On level 22 he found the Hell Staff!
Then at last he found Dis!
On level 24 he finally defeated the Mastermind.
-- Messages --------------------------------------------------
missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched! The
missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched! The
missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched!
You are hit! You are hit! You are hit! You are hit! You are hit! You are hit!
You use a large med-pack. You feel fully healed.
You quickly reload the plasma rifle.
The missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The missile hits the Spider
Mastermind. The missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind
flinched! The missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind
flinched! The missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind
flinched! The missile hits the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind
flinched!
You quickly reload the plasma rifle. Your power battery is depleted.
You hear the scream of a freed soul! Congratulations! You defeated the Spider
Mastermind! Press <Enter>...
You feel relatively safe now.
-- General ---------------------------------------------------
2268 brave souls have ventured into Phobos:
1805 of those were killed.
5 of those were killed by something unknown.
74 didn't read the thermonuclear bomb manual.
And 234 couldn't handle the stress and committed a stupid suicide.
150 souls destroyed the Mastermind...
15 sacrificed itself for the good of mankind.
131 killed the bitch and survived.
4 showed that it can outsmart Hell itself.
--------------------------------------------------------------
--- End code ---
Slightly off-topic, here's a cool screenshot of a random game I played about a week ago that I forgot about:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Anyway, after that badge, I went for Berserker Diamond Badge. Given that melee is very hard on Nightmare when you can't be skipping everything, I opted to rush to floor 7, and then create a setup where I could repeatedly kill a weak enemy to buff up my kill count requirement. I got lucky with getting a run after just a few tries!
This was definitely a lucky start to this floor, and was also fantastic for experience:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And even luckier than it would appear!
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
With the double Invulnerability and a lucky floor 6...
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
I was able to clear out an arena type floor on Hell 7, and wiped out all the corpses too, leaving just a single Revenant. While they're fairly dangerous, they have very low HP and are easy to repeatedly kill:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Once I reached enough kills (went a fair bit higher than necessary lol), I used the Chainsaw Berserk trick on Dis, charged the Spider Mastermind, and hit her with flinching hits until she died!
Spoiler (click to show/hide)--------------------------------------------------------------
DoomRL (0.9.9.7) roguelike post-mortem character dump
--------------------------------------------------------------
y5see, level 6 Apostle Chaos Br. General Scout,
defeated the Mastermind at the City of Dis.
He survived 86497 turns and scored 116647 points.
He played for 13 minutes and 29 seconds.
He opposed the Nightmare!
He killed 344 out of 471 hellspawn. (73%)
He was an Angel of Berserk!
He was also an Angel of Overconfidence!
-- Special levels --------------------------------------------
Levels generated : 4
Levels visited : 0
Levels completed : 0
-- Awards ----------------------------------------------------
UAC Star (gold cluster)
Berserker Diamond Badge
-- Graveyard -------------------------------------------------
###########################################################
####................................#####################>#
###...............####...............######################
##.......####.....####.....####.......#####################
#........####.....####.....####........####################
.........####.....####.....####.........###################
.........####..............####.X........##################
................................%.........#################
..####............................####....#################
.&####............................####....#################
..####............................####....#################
..####............................####....#################
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#........####.....####.....####........####################
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###########################################################
-- Statistics ------------------------------------------------
Health 15/50 Experience 14368/6
ToHit Ranged +0 ToHit Melee +6 ToDmg Ranged +0 ToDmg Melee +9
-- Traits ----------------------------------------------------
Class : Scout
Finesse (Level 2)
Brute (Level 3)
Berserker (Level 1)
Bru->Bru->Ber->Bru->Fin->Fin->
-- Equipment -------------------------------------------------
[a] [ Armor ] red armor [6/6] (64%) (P)
[b] [ Weapon ] chainsaw (4d7) (P)
[c] [ Boots ] nothing
[d] [ Prepared ] nothing
-- Inventory -------------------------------------------------
[a] rocket (x3)
[b] small med-pack
[c] large med-pack
[d] large med-pack
[e] homing phase device
[f] power mod pack
[g] technical mod pack
[h] bulk mod pack
-- Resistances -----------------------------------------------
Bullet - internal 60% torso 60% feet 60%
Melee - internal 60% torso 60% feet 60%
Shrapnel - internal 60% torso 60% feet 60%
Acid - internal 60% torso 60% feet 60%
Fire - internal 60% torso 85% feet 60%
Plasma - internal 60% torso 60% feet 60%
-- Kills -----------------------------------------------------
7 former sergeants
2 former captains
7 imps
7 demons
34 lost souls
2 cacodemons
2 barons of hell
9 arachnotrons
2 former commandos
4 pain elementals
254 revenants
6 mancubi
7 arch-viles
1 Spider Mastermind
-- History ---------------------------------------------------
On level 3 he stumbled into a complex full of arch-viles!
He left level 6 as soon as possible.
Then at last he found Dis!
On level 8 he finally defeated the Mastermind.
-- Messages --------------------------------------------------
taste blood!
You hit the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched! You need to
taste blood!
You need to taste blood!
You are hit! You are hit! You are hit! You are hit! You are hit! You are hit!
You need to taste blood!
You hit the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched! You're going
berserk! You need to taste blood!
You hit the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched! You need to
taste blood!
You need to taste blood!
You need to taste blood!
You hit the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind flinched! You need to
taste blood!
You hit the Spider Mastermind. The Spider Mastermind dies. Congratulations!
You defeated the Spider Mastermind! Press <Enter>...
-- General ---------------------------------------------------
2274 brave souls have ventured into Phobos:
1810 of those were killed.
5 of those were killed by something unknown.
74 didn't read the thermonuclear bomb manual.
And 234 couldn't handle the stress and committed a stupid suicide.
151 souls destroyed the Mastermind...
15 sacrificed itself for the good of mankind.
132 killed the bitch and survived.
4 showed that it can outsmart Hell itself.
--------------------------------------------------------------
--- End code ---
Two diamond badges in one night is pretty sweet at this point! This brings my count to 19, still with Heroic and Centurial in the bank waiting! :)
I'll probably start playing for Angel of 100 on Nightmare now and hopefully it doesn't take too long. :P I'm thinking of doing a Shotgun->Melee build with Intuition x2 -> Hellrunner x2 -> Dodgemaster -> Brute x2 -> Berserker -> Brute -> Beyond. It works out well since I'd of course want Blademaster, but only take 3 extra traits beforehand, all of which are helpful for melee builds anyway. Completing this challenge will give the double diamond badge and the last remaining medal, giving me my last major group of rewards, completing another page on my player stats, and leaving a great mark on my progress!
Hopefully I get some good luck on my runs!
Tormuse:
(Psst... in AoRA, if you pick up an invulnerability just before the nuke goes off, you survive the nuke and it's an easy way to clear the level) :)
As Sereg said, brilliant theorycrafting! :) I was ready to criticize back when you said your strategy revolved around finding a Trigun or Power Battery, (I know I said that N! games require luck, but being lucky isn't really a "strategy") :P but hey, if you're getting results, who am I to complain? :D
--- Quote from: Sereg on November 06, 2017, 10:27 ---For reference I submit my Dervis mortem, which I completed in under an hour real-time.
--- End quote ---
Oh, hey, that's cool! I didn't realize that game was that quick! I remember a time, back in version 0.9.9.1, when your game had to be under an hour to get Centurial Diamond; no one ever achieved it and it was deemed impossible, so I guess you proved that wrong! :D (Mind you, there was no Scout class, and so no stair sense back then)
Icy:
Surviving the nuke is nice for quick clears, but I didn't want to risk the Invulnerabilities getting destroyed or getting attacked in the open. Hoping for luck or using cheesy tactics may not be the most appealing method for many players, but I'm an optimizer and strategist, and will always use all my resources available to achieve my goals. :)
Day 63:
Against what was recommended, I tried some Angel of 100 with Max Carnage on Nightmare and it didn't go too well. :P While Max Carnage is advantageous in combat and ammo conservation, the monster density is high enough where many starting points are surrounded and hard to control. I'll have to settle with raw Angel of 100 attempts.
I rotated a bit more, but didn't do anything spectacular. I also tried some more for Pacifist Angelic Badge and reached a new furthest point. This was a sketchy situation with nothing dying fortunately:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Lucky floor 5:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Lucky floor 6:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Rougher floor 7. To avoid monsters killing each other, I had to take a long swim through acid:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
It seems that for Phobos Anomaly though, you need yet even more luck with a Phase Device for a realistic chance to get through without anything dying:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
Another Lost Soul got trashed too lol:
Spoiler (click to show/hide)
And now for an overall progress discussion and how I'm feeling about all the remaining challenges. :)
One of the things with massively improving (in anything really) is having a stronger realization and understanding of how difficult certain tasks are, how talented top players are, and what's realistic. When I first started playing and writing here, I figured that while being a noob, I could eventually develop enough skill to get absolutely everything. Of course with plateaus, you begin to think that (now easy) other challenges are impossible until they are overcome and the process cycles until the next bump.
The thing is that I've learned a ton about this game now and I'd like to think I'm quite competent with how to play effectively. Yet, I truly don't think I'll ever achieve absolutely 100% of everything, not that I couldn't, but I don't want to end up investing thousands of hours just for certain badges. Speedrunner Angelic Badge comes to mind, but there are a couple others that are totally fucked too. Surely, anyone can get Speedrunner Angelic Badge with enough luck, but to beat the game in 4 minutes on Nightmare has very little to do with skill or learning. It's entirely a slot machine that would take a ridiculously stupid amount of time to get, which could of course be used on countless other things.
With all of this in mind, I also have a much better understanding of why people are very skeptical about 2Dev and VANDAM. I'm a firm believer of innocent until proven guilty, but being so casual about Demonic Angelic Badge doesn't make any sense, not to mention actually achieving it. If there were a supercomputer that would calculate all the mathematics and probabilities of every action and choose the best one each time, I imagine it still wouldn't be able to achieve the badge on most runs. Or just maybe, they know some secret tactics that I haven't figured out yet. Or perhaps they clocked in an ungodly number of hours.
For confirmed players, I'd strongly argue Papilio is the DoomRL's #1 with countless videos and mortems of super difficult challenges, duplicating many of those badges, and beating many without challenge abuse. Tormuse is definitely in that same tier by flaunting the most confirmed angelic badges, especially Everyman Angelic Badge. I'd say I'm a comfy 3rd place, but still behind by a major skill gap that I want to overcome.
Now, this isn't me giving up and vanishing or anything like that, but having learned and improved a lot with the game, I'm definitely going to scale my goals back a bit. Mindless grinding with little to no meaningful input by the player is not appealing at all (I'm perfectly fine with churning out runs though), but there are still many badges that offer a fair and difficult challenge that I want to accomplish. And because the game is a ton of fun, I'm definitely going to do a lot of my own personal challenges. One in particular I want to do eventually is a 100% kill game of Archangel of 666 on Ultra-Violence. I also want to do a bunch more of Max Carnage + Angel of 100 runs. Perhaps I'll also go for "un-Sereg'd" badge challenges too.
Here are my current thoughts on my remaining unachieved badges:
Strongman Platinum Badge - Tough, but doable with Invulnerability luck and using the Chainsaw for Babel and Dis.
Elite Platinum Badge - I don't think this challenge is too bad, but having to go through a long game with Mortuary/Limbo waiting near the end is scary. I'll probably go for 100% kills on this run for the needed experience.
Demonic Platinum Badge - Many of the bonus levels can be immediately exited, so I don't think this is too much harder than a regular Nightmare game. Again, Mortuary/Limbo waiting near the end is going to kill a lot of long runs, but I can definitely get this.
Marksman Platinum Badge - Probably the hardest platinum badge in my opinion. I'll likely go with a Sharpshooter build for this, but I've really never been a fan of using Pistols. Needing to kill everything keeps the player honest and also means mixing with Overconfidence is unrealistic.
Heroic Diamond Badge/Centurial Diamond Badge/Dervis' Medallion - Mostly needs a lucky start, ideally early Inquisitor set, and then it's just a stairdive. Even if this was much tougher, my last medal and a pair of diamond badges is a huge incentive to finish this soon.
Strongman Diamond Badge - Pretty damn hard. Papilio has achieved it, but I might be skipping this one.
Elite Diamond Badge - Basic Nightmare game with respawn grinding on the floor before Dis. Pretty easy, but time-consuming.
Demonic Diamond Badge - Very hard badge to earn. I think it will take a really lucky Phobos episode, followed by Invulnerability luck. Might skip it.
Everyman Diamond Badge - A step up in difficulty from platinum, but I can and will definitely get it.
Arena Diamond Badge - Really dumb luckfest badge, lol. I think only Tormuse has got it? I think the only way I'll be getting it is with a Butcher's Cleaver on floor 2, which I'm not too ecstatic to go for.
UAC Angelic Badge - Totally fucked. Nobody confirmed to have achieved.
Strongman Angelic Badge - Only Tormuse has it, and I'm not exactly excited for punching enemies for hours on end lol. Will probably skip it.
Speedrunner Angelic Badge - lol
Elite Angelic Badge - A couple players have this one which is surprising to me. Maybe I can get it on a Trigun run. :P
Demonic Angelic Badge - Shouldn't be realistically possible.
Berserker Angelic Badge - Tormuse has it from a lucky run. I'd definitely need more Invulnerability luck to get it.
Marksman Angelic Badge - Papilio and a couple others have it I think? I'm already not keen on Marksman Platinum Badge lol. I think a stair-dive with respawn grinding at the end would work, but I don't think I'll go for it.
Eagerness Angelic Badge - Nope.
Inquisitor Angelic Badge - Totally fucked.
Quartermaster Angelic Badge - It seems quite a few players have this one, and I think I can get it too. I'll definitely play for it.
Masochist Angelic Badge - I believe this is the "easiest" unachieved angelic badge? While health boosts are blocked, you can still run around Invulnerable. It's essentially a lighter version of UAC/Demonic, except you can't restore tactics either. I might try for it.
Centurial Angelic Badge - Will definitely get this one at some point.
Pacifist Angelic Badge - Never achieved and I don't think I will be getting it either. It requires far too much luck to be worth grinding for. On the plus side though, it's a nice fallback during a bad gameplay session, or for a few quick runs, so who knows. Maybe after long enough, I'll accidentally get it.
Everyman Angelic Badge - Totally fucked, but Tormuse somehow got it. Of all things though, not being able to use Intuition x2 is keeping me away from it lol.
In summary, I will go for all the remaining platinum badges, most of all the diamond badges (skipping Strongman, Demonic, and Arena), and I'll get at least up to 6 angelic badges for another ranking promotion. I'll probably be getting Centurial Angelic Badge, Quartermaster Angelic Badge, and one other, maybe Elite Angelic Badge.
I'm still overall happy with my progress thus far and have been having a blast, but this is now The Journey to 95%. :P When you shoot for the stars, you still get pretty far into space, and I definitely wouldn't have got as far as I have if not going for 100% to begin with. The top 10 in anything competitive are not players who just want top 10, but 1st.
You do indeed earn your namesake with "No-Life King", and I'm not willing to take that kind of plunge. :P I'll continue doing my best and while I think I won't be going beyond 3rd place in ranks/badges, I'd like to close the gap a bit to Papilio and Tormuse, as well as getting as far up as I can. I just wanted to share my thoughts on the game at this point where I'm seriously running low of realistically doable challenges and being nearly forced to grind for stupidly difficult challenges, but as I said, I'll still be continuing strong, so don't worry. :)
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