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[AlterAsc]

Me and my friend speculated that you need to do damageless arena on N! and several more specials levels damageless too. Not sure if there's damage taken threshold for normal levels though.

The problem about all these 'simple' solutions is that different people think of different things first when they hear 'simple'. God knows how frustrating it can be when you need to figure something 'obvious'.

[Fanta Hege]

I'm gona spoiler my theory about the quarenteed DS spawn:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Evidently, looking at the mortems by 2dev and the few other people whom have done N! runs that consist of either conquer or 100% otherwise + the ones that have the DS I've noticed few things:

It doesn't have to be 100%
It doesn't have to be completely damageless
It doesn't have to be conquer

However:
All the runs have less than 100k turns that have the DS.
Some have under 50k.
They all have UAC star gold cluster
Everything is on N!

Thus I think it's either:
-Reach UC as fast as possible, however taking in account AoOC's I think this might not be it.
-Kill all the monsters in UC as a killing spree (without damage), explains the gold cluster star, explains why 2dev has been getting it with his magics. Seriously hard though with the lost souls. Thus very likely?
-Be berserk the whole damn run in the UC till you get the AoD dead. Again, explains the star cluster, explains why you have to reach it quickly, but unlikely?
All have to be in N! ofcourse

I'm almost tempted to go test if I can get it to spawn but I really lack patience for low damage N! runs.

[Matt_S]

And so it begins... The forced spawn hypothesizing.  This one I actually only know because of looking at the source code.

Spoiler: so vague it's not even really a hint (click to show/hide)

The condition actually is pretty simple, as far as explaining it at least.  Accomplishing it, maybe not.

[Sereg]

Lol. It's probably just there so 2Dev can have guaranteed DS/BA. Looking at his runs, and considering the possible conditions from that perspective... it doesn't seem like something a lot of people are likely to manage.

[GinDiamond]

Not quite, I don't think it has to be N!.

What I have figured out is there is a major misconception about the Berserker Armor and the DS: you actually have to pick UP the DS in order to wear the Berserker Armor.

So, you are able to pick up the DS FIRST, but not USE it until you get the Berserker Armor to drop?

[Rajhin]

Not quite, I don't think it has to be N!.

What I have figured out is there is a major misconception about the Berserker Armor and the DS: you actually have to pick UP the DS in order to wear the Berserker Armor.

So, you are able to pick up the DS FIRST, but not USE it until you get the Berserker Armor to drop?

It HAS to be N! to spawn DS/BA on scripted places (but they can also be spawned by random as any other unique).  You ARE able to use  DS without BA. Actually you are unable to use something else because DS goes into you hand on pick up and cannot be swapped (but you can pick something in offhand with "u" - that should be handy for MMK making it really badass). You must have DS to wear BA (but it is kinda crappy armour, i suggest wearing it only for final fight).

[GinDiamond]

So here's what I can gather:

1. A full on Conqueror run will NOT get you the DS or the BA.
2. It HAS to be Nightmare! (of course, why would it be on UV?)
3. You IMMEDIATELY equip the DS on pickup from the UC
4. You get the BA on The Mortuary (possibly also Limbo?)
5. The DS only gains full strength (9d9) when used with the BA.

I guess I could use Tourist Mod to test some stuff out here.

[Matt_S]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

5 is not correct.

There's still one thing I'm curious about though... What happens if you already got the DS and/or BA to randomly spawn and then trigger the forced spawns?  Will you get duplicated uniques?  Crashes?

Also...

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Berserker Armor is not as bad as the wiki would suggest.

[GinDiamond]

It's too heavy! No human could ever wield this thing... There is a             
 Dragonslayer (9d9) lying here.                                                 
                                                                               
    ùùùùùùùùùùù  ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù           
  ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù===============================ùùùùùùùùùùùù         
 #ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù============================ùùùùùùù============ùùùùùùùùù       
 #ùùùùùùùùùù===================ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù===================ùùù     
 #ùùùùùùù=========ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù============ùù   
 #ùùùùùù======ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù======ùù   
 #ùùùùù=====ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù=====ùù   
 #ùùùù=====ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù=====ùù   
 #ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù=====ùù 
 #ù>ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù@ùùù====ùùù 
 #ùùùù=====ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù====ùùù 
 #ùùùùù=====ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù=====ùù   
 #ùùùùùù======ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù======ùùù   
 #ùùùùùùù=========ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù============ùù   
 #ùùùùùùùùùù===================ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù===================ùùùù   
 #ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù===========================ùùùùùùù============ùùùùùùùùùùù     
  ùùùùùùùùùùùùù  ùùùùùùùùùùùù=============================ùùùùùùùùùùùùùùù       
                                                               ùùùùùùùù         
                                                                 ####           
  Patrick                    Armor : Tourist suit [10/10] (100%) (P)           
  Health: 174% Exp: 18/4%    Weapon: Cosmo blaster (5d6) [100/100]             
  cautious                                                    Unholy Cathedral 

[Kristopher]

Man, at least everyone else can find the stupid thing. =P

[Sereg]

         
  Patrick                    Armor : Tourist suit [10/10] (100%) (P)           
  Health: 174% Exp: 18/4%    Weapon: Cosmo blaster (5d6) [100/100]             
  cautious                                                    Unholy Cathedral 

This was a mod - he fulfilled the UC generation conditions and forced it to spawn, I think. In any case, I've never found a Tourist suit in DoomRL ;)

If it helps, my only DS finds occurred on AAo666 games.

[Kristopher]

This was a mod - he fulfilled the UC generation conditions and forced it to spawn, I think. In any case, I've never found a Tourist suit in DoomRL ;)

If it helps, my only DS finds occurred on AAo666 games.

I saw the tourist suit, but somehow passed up on the UC part. Whoopsie.

And yeah, maybe I'll have to try that sometime, but AAo666 really does just sound like a complete and utter grind. I've done more than a few Ao100 games, but I haven't found it on them (surprisingly), and even those feel kinda grindy if I don't play Scout and start rushing to the stairs after a certain level.

[shark20061]

There's still one thing I'm curious about though... What happens if you already got the DS and/or BA to randomly spawn and then trigger the forced spawns?  Will you get duplicated uniques?  Crashes?

It's extremely unlikely but it looks like it's possible to have a randomly spawned DS and then trigger the guaranteed one.  For the DS, you won't be able to pick it up.  It's slightly more likely with the BA, and you can pick up the second BA, but it's pointless if you already have one.

[Equality]

@GinDiamond:

yes, but it not intended. At least by me. When I make debug module I think that no DS at custom mods. But it spawns... :) surprise

[Fanta Hege]

This was a mod - he fulfilled the UC generation conditions and forced it to spawn, I think

Well I just did the same thing and was able to pin point it out.
it really is some serious level of difficulty to make it spawn but not exactly 2dev level.

Well no need to worry about that anymore